And That's What You REALLY MissedGet ready to sparkle with Glee when superfan Dylan Mulvaney stops by to spread joy and share some hilarious stories involving the show!
The author and influencer admits what Glee meant to her growing up, going to the live tour in San Diego after suffering an unforgettable hair color mishap, singing and partying with Chris Colfer, and the reveal of all reveals ... the gleeking roles she auditioned for which send Jenna and Kevin into hysterics!
Plus, Dylan details what's come true on her vision board, what she is manifesting that might affect all of them, texting with Gaga, and her bestselling book, "Paper Doll," which is available now!
For fun clips and more inside scoop, don't forget to follow us on Instagram @andthatswhatyoureallymissedpod!
And that's what you really missed with Jenna and Kevin an iHeartRadio podcast.
Welcome to and that's what you're the most podcast. We have a icon today.
An icon, a legend, an original gleek like I cannot even and stayed till the bitter end.
Yeah, and it really was bitter our gleek of the week this week, Dylan, I cannot believe it. I'm so excited.
Chris is BFF and she needs really no introduction, Like, if you don't know, get out of here. If you don't, this is a great way to get to know. That's true.
Sorry, I'm not going to shame you, Okay, Dylan, Molvanie everybody.
I'm in a bed and I thought, you know what, They're not going to judge me for that.
No, you know what, I want to get in bed, so.
I do like tiny room at iHeart because my WiFi is not working today. So I'm literally in a hair and makeup like set right up against the light.
Yeah, you're lighting is good.
Kevin, thank you called them and they were like, yeah, I guess you can come here.
Yea in this closet.
I'm like, trauma, Yeah, put you back in the closet, and I have another apology for you. I'm sorry I had to cancel that first time that we were going to record. I will tell you that too. It was the first press tour I've ever done for anything, and I didn't know what that meant, to the extent of like you saying yes to everything and then finding out that you can't, Like it was before I think, and I was like, I like the world started to like shut down and close it on me, and I was like, I don't think I would make it to the next two weeks. But I did hear through our dear friend Chris that you guys went worked like what a year and a half straight for a period of time there at the beginning. So mm hmm, yeah, I just had it. I had a brief few weeks of that and I needed a moment. But now we're here.
No, no, don't even worry about it. We get that you're preaching to the choir. We get it.
We fully It is good for you for just saying, you know what, I can't advocating for yourself because so.
Hard it is, especially when it's like you did something really big, like you released a book. That is so hard and then you're like, well, I need to be out there doing everything. And I ran into you at the Elton John after party Oscar thing.
Yes, and we've seen each other a few times.
Yeah, what did I say? What did I immediately do?
Immediately started apologizing and I was like, girl, don't you really and you told me.
What was going on?
I was like, no, the positive is exactly what Jenna just said. Okay, you shook a moment and you're like, you know what, I can't do.
Everycate right now.
I don't remember the profuse apology there, because then maybe I wouldn't have come in with a hot like apology. I think I maybe am, like I can't remember anything, like it is really getting scary the amount of things I like just completely slipped my mind.
This is great because we spend half of this podcast talking about how we don't remember anything, and so this one write in the club because that crazy. It's like when you were doing all of these things, they all start to run together, plots to get through the day, right, like when you like talk about like what you might have had to do in a single day in your press tour.
Oh, I mean that was it was giving three podcasts, two talk shows fitting and uh like it it was. I think what's weird is making something and then like having to then talk about it after the fact. It feels like kind of embarrassing because you're like, I made this thing, and I hope it's good, but then you're told that what's important is actually you talking about the thing yep. And and so I don't know, I think, do you guys like doing that kind of press stuff where you're like being shuttled from room to room.
No, who likes talking about themselves that much?
I think I think like the project itself, like you know, if you care about it, of course you want to promote it and talk about being okay of course, Yeah, but there's like a limit to like, then the questions that you get aren't always about.
That thank you, And I will say I was really excited to go into some of those spaces and not have it be for social media and have it be for like a tangible, real thing that I wrote, because I think a lot of the times there is still the stigma of like you know, going viral online, and then I think still the word influencer is very like triggering to me in a way.
Because I started in theater.
I spent my entire life doing musical theater, and then to get put in this other box was kind of alarming. But I will say I had these weird flashes of like when I was on the View or certain like kind of maybe spaces that weren't as queer friendly or just you know that we're doing some more journalism that was less fun for me or less about the book, and it felt more about my identity, and I think that was really crazy of like having to speak on behalf of community, which I never want to do or sign up for. Or I'm being asked about sports like trans people in sports and I'm like I never played sports, Like like why am I'm not that girl? But I do feel confident enough in my Glee watching abilities to be on this podcast right now, so so, and and there was I got. I had this feeling when I well, I was going to say when I got into bed today, but when I stayed in.
Bed today to be on this podcast.
Then I was not going to be thrilled about trans people in sports.
I just had this I mean, I promise, okay, okay, we promise.
So there's a new build. I'm kidding, I don't even know. I don't know.
One of my favorite like tidbits about you, Dylan, is that most people know you from like your journey on TikTok, and you are getting put into this box, but you are through and through a musical theater queen.
Yes, thank you. It's all I care about.
It's like why I live and why I still like And in a way, I think when I was going viral on the internet, I just thought, oh, I hope this helps me get to the stage, and I hope that like maybe, And then it's funny when I started to sing online or when I, you know, did something like a theater sketch, people would be like, whoa where did this come from? And it is funny when you try to like soft launch like the musical theater energy into the mainstream, because there's usually a lot of pushback. But I think now it has a.
Lot of good will with the people you know, Yes, and.
Now they trust me enough to well And honestly, this book is like when I think about who it's for, it's for theater kids, and it's for people that watched your show. It's for I mean, I write about something very specific was my experience auditioning for musical theater colleges, and because I last night I looked up Glee, like to see where all the hits would be. But the one specific, bigger story of my relationship to Glee was that I thought Neoto was a real place. I was going to go there, and then I found out that it was like Julie Are or like, like that's what I thought it was. So then I, I mean, the the home screen of my phone was Juilliard. I was going to Juilliard for musical theater. Then the shock of going onto the website like this is senior year and I'm like going to sign up for musical theater and they don't have music and I went oh and and so I was like, well, I guess I'm auditioning for the acting program with him. And then it said you needed Shakespeare monologue, and I guess I'm not going here.
No.
I mean, I still really put all, I threw my full into that audition, but it didn't work out. It did not work out, and I think that that's okay to go to Niada and and we're not all meant to go to Jilliard.
No, I did audition for Juilliard as well.
It was one of my only college auditions and I didn't get it. Didn't go well, look at us now, exactly at us now here we are okay. So, because you were and are a musical theater junkie, I'm curious how you got into glee where you were in your life, where you physically were like the whole thing. But also like now, I'm curious when the musical theater park started or was it like straight out the room?
Yes, yes, yes, yes. Well I will start out by just telling you that I'm so happy to be on this with you both because you mean so much to me and young Dylan and I started theater when I was well. I started dancing when I was three years old in San Diego, where I'm from. But I live, like I always say about San Diego, like the farther from the beach you get, the more that they don't love gay people. And I lived very far from the beach, and so I was said little town called Alpine, California. I was the only boy in the dance school, and I felt really lucky that my parents even let me do that. And I started auditioning for The Grinch at the Old Globe and I was like six years old. Finally booked it when I was ten because I found out you didn't just have to dance, you also had to sing. And then oh my god, what year? What did what year did Glee start?
Two thousand and nine?
Okay, that meant I was twelve, twelve or thirteen? And I remember watching the pilot episode with my mom. Was it after American Idol madea or sink you we were already avid American Idol watchers. This was It also came during a time where like I was in the thick of going through puberty, which was like I mean, the the hormone spikes and the fighting with my parents and like because I hated what was happening to my body. But then I also I was such a mama's kid in a way, and I think that as our it was almost like our relationship was like measured by Thursday nights watching Glee or was it Wednesdays or Thursdays?
Switch? Sometimes it was Tuesdays, sometimes it was Wednesday.
Okay, would we would record we would record it if if I if it was a dad weekend because my parents got divorced, but I I would basically like me and my mom made it like our ritual every week to watch the thing. And I grew up super Catholic and conservative, and so it's funny that like that was the thing, but I do think that was where we found the common ground, whether it was through and I mean the Kurt Humble character. Even though you know now I am a trans woman, Like I think back to my teen years and I just think of femininity as like the way that I lived my life and how soft I was, and how even like my singing voice, I always like I had this like really strong falsetto that no one would let me use because they said that boys don't do that right. And then Chris Colfer walks on the screen and I was like being hit by a ton of bricks, and because I had never seen anyone that looked like that, sounded like that, acted like that, And there were so many parallels, like even single Ladies, like backstage at the Old Globe during the Grinch, like it would be me and the adult ensemble women doing the single Ladies dance on the stage and then watching that on my screen of being like, oh, oh my god, there's other people that are like this. Too, and so that really was a theme. I also I went to the Glee concert and it was oh I was there, bitch, and it was one of them in San Diego I had It was one of three days that I had platinum blonde bleached hair because I got I went to the Paul Mitchell School downtown without telling my parents, sat in a chair for seven hours. It was bright yellow. They didn't know how to tone it. And and then when I got home, it was the night of the Glee concert and she was like, oh my god, I can't believe we're going to Glee like this, and it's just like so mortified. And then we immediately died it back. But I was that blonde fantasy at that concert. And now I think what's so funny about like the synchronicities of life is like Glee.
Just keeps coming back into my life.
Like obviously, you know, Chris and I are now like dear, dear friends, and that I think is such a pinch me moment in itself of like that is someone where I'm like, meet your heroes, because that one really worked out and we got to talk about Chris, but also like Josie Toda is one of my closest, closest friends, and we had this moment early on where we started to get to know each other and she came over and she's like, I have something to show you, and I was like, really nervous, like what that was? And then she put on she went to my YouTube on my laptop and put on Lose Lose My Breath Destiny's Child performance episode where she was dancing, and I was like, what the Like the lore behind Josie Toda as a whole She's been on like every single show ever. No, but she's she's so far from being like theater girl in my mind, like she's so cool that I'm like, wait, you were what? And so I just loved And then now Kevin, getting to see you and Jenna, have I gotten to meet you in person yet?
Now I don't think so that's crazy to me.
That's crazy to me, And now we're going to make it happen. But Kevin, do you remember one specific kind of crazy place that we saw each other in?
Was the box? Yeah?
Well did in my book in the Box, I almost want to say that was the first time we met.
I think it was because I'm a huge fan of yours and have been like following you online. And I knew you and Chris were friends, and I knew we have a bunch of mutual friends. And I saw you and I was like, oh, thank god, because I also was like, what am I doing here right now?
Yes, it was. It was an odd group of it was.
It was you were sitting on the couch across from me. I was like sitting in a couch. Everyone else like, you know, up being crazy and we're like what are we what's happening? And I saw you and I was like, We're gonna be okay. Yeah, well I need to go introduce myself.
Well, I I write in papered all about how like the box For some reason, when I was like a teenager with like a fake ID was like my dream, Like I had heard of this place and and that is kind of like weirdly a musical theater pipeline club for people, because it's like you're dancing for like twenty minutes and then like the lights go down and then there's a big show. But obviously it's not a musical. It's like crazy sexy acts of you know, Jenna, have you beenauchery?
Yes, yes, it's.
Oh yeah, it's too much for me insanity. But but Kevin, I remember seeing you know, I was like, how the hell did we end up at this place? At the same time, I think I was sitting on like Lucas Gage's lap and uh, there's there's a there's a there's a group of gay people now that exist in our world. And my my Chris Colfer meet cute though was.
How did this happen? Because I love seeing your friendship. I love that like Christmas part of your book tour.
I got him to sing yeah, you sound great together, thank you, and I was.
Like, oh, Chris loves this bitch if he is singing live.
Because no, no, no, Chris, I saw him.
It was bros. It was my first movie premiere I had ever gone to. And I walked to the carpet and at that point I had been to a few events and seeing some people, but I think my literal like insids just like dropped out when I saw Chris Colfer across this like AMC downtown or wherever the hell we were on and I was like, oh, and I was with er fight Master, who like, is this like hot non binary daddy? And I was like, oh, my god, Oh my god, and they're like, what is going on, Like not the person that I needed for that moment of like do you realize how big this is? And and so I was like, I've got to do it, and I walk up, you know, I introduced myself. Chris had absolutely no idea who I was, which was so lovely in itself. And and I one of my favorite things about that was starting when I started going to the events, some people had like an idea of like who I was based on my content or you know, had some of these like parasocial relationships. But then after the premiere, we went to the after party and we started drinking together quite heavily, and I think he was like I like this girl, and and you know, gave me his number, and it was like, oh, I'm so glad that we had kind of an organic.
Meeting in that way. Yeah, and.
Now we've gone, oh my god, We've gone to Disneyland together a few times. He took my club thirty three Virginity, which, like it was, Trump had just been elected in this past November, and I get I mean, there was such a a there was a grim energy in the air of la and I get a text from Chris Colfer this like you want to go to Club thirty three? And I was like, I think that is actually the only situation that could could could heal whatever happening right now?
Me out of bed.
Yeah, And I will say Chris is probably the funnest person to like drink or go dancing totally.
It's so fun It's so funny you say that because because Chris like was such a like a sweet, demure, innocent soul when we met him, and so much has evolved for him and opened up and I you know, his all of his experience and our relationship with him, Like it's just so beautiful to see him living his.
Life the way he is now at his fullest and like just like not afraid in some way, and like I don't want to speak for him or what he's feeling with like it comes across that way, like just so quintessentially Chris, like roller skating parties and book parties at a museum. It's just like it breathes like Chris Colfur, which is the Chris we knew, but we were just like dying for him to like break out into who he really is.
And so that's just like.
Joining himself and you feel the joy from Yeah, he worked so hard and he still does. He works very hard. But he worked so hard for so many years and didn't really give him it seemed like, give himself that freedom, have to enjoy the success he's worked for and he's fully realized out there and every time, Like Amber and I ran into him a couple of months ago, we were out and we're like, oh no, how are we going to keep up with Chris?
And will it just it turned into it a Chris It turned into a Chris Knight.
I love it. I love it. So you guys sang together, Oh my god, there we go.
That was That was my year too, sort of celebration to benefit the Trevor Project. And I am really in division boards and I hid mostly. I would say eighty five percent of my twenty twenty three vision board had come true. And then success got to tell people what it is you want.
They try to make it happen over here, just happen.
I then did one for twenty twenty four and I put his duet, the Get Happy. I just cut out a picture of them doing that duet, and I put my face onto Lea's body. And I was like, I want to do it with Chris Cooper, like that's what that's what I want, and and I forget exactly like he kind of just did, like he was like, Okay, let's do this.
Wow.
And it had been a few years since he had sung live, but it was like I remember. It was also do you have these moments in your life where so much crazy cool stuff is happening that you disassociate and then you don't really like live in it when it's happening. Oh yeah that I had this, like very clear. I was like holding his hand. We're in my watching tuxedos, and I was like, Dylan, you live in this book. I was like, look into Chris Colfer's eyes and realize what is happening because you may never feel this happy again.
I get it. I get it.
That's what a good moment to check yourself, like be present, be present.
That was open. Now I know what you mean.
But I also had this moment when it was happening where it was like, what if this is the best I will ever feel in my entire life and it's all downhill from this?
Is it? Like we've peaked.
I've had so many moments in these past three years where I've been like, well, I like that's it, that's all.
Like I mean we talked about that in twenty fifteen, twenty twelve, you know, like that's why we were like checking things off a bucket list we never thought we'd ever check off in our whole lives.
Like you fly in a private day.
You meet Obama, you're meeting, You're going on Oprah, Like that's it.
Like I don't know what else there is to do, you know, I don't know, but I think you've proven that, like there are there's more time, more experiences, because you'd probably just start surprising yourself.
Yeah, I did just write about there are some things that I'd still like to do. I would love to meet Dolly Parton. Still, I really I wanted to perform I was in the Book of Mormon the National Tour, but I really want to do a role on Broadway as a female because I think that is going to be such a full circle moment because like I grew up loving theater and that was always my safe place. But even when I was like going into these characters, I was always like trying to be something that I really ultimately wasn't a part of me and my identity, and so now getting to audition for things, I love it even more, which I didn't know was possible. But I'm like, oh, this is what I'm supposed to be doing. Sure, And I think that a lot of people think of me as this like activist when I'm like, honey, I like that. I'm a theater but yeah, I really think that advocating for trans people in theater and in you know, musical, TV and film, like, that's something that I really want to advocate for a while I'm here, because we haven't gotten to see enough of it, right, Are.
There any shows or roles that you are dying to do? Yeah, let's talk about this for a second. Let's talk about like, yeah, a five year plan, vision board twenty actually get this.
I have not made my twenty twenty five vision board, okay, because I going into it, I was a little like, what is this, you know, legislatively as a trans person, I was like, what does this?
What's this year going to give?
And I was like I almost just want the goal to be like stay alive and feel safe and and maybe let's not try to project too much more onto that. What I will say is that like so many dream scenarios have happened, so that like I almost feel like I'm gonna end up doing a vision board at the end of the year of all the.
Good things that did great, but I love that, but or maybe we're gonna get it.
I kept telling myself, like in January, then February of the March, I was like, you know what, next week, we're gonna we're gonna make that vision board.
Now too late, Like I don't mind, like a year of calm, you know, that was my word for the year. I do a word for the year versus a vision board, and like my year my word was calm. Now, I don't know that we've necessarily gotten that starting out in January and la like, wasn't it commers Yep.
Yeah exactly.
But I am feeling this thing for you of your vision board that is like it's okay to have a calm year and then you know, regroup at the end of the year and then do one.
Maybe next year instead.
It's okay, but it has not been a calm year yet for any of us.
No.
I did have one big vision board thing that I'm gonna put on is do you ever take baths?
Do you ever do lush bath bombs?
I got. I got my own Lush bath bomb and that was like that dream Colloud, like if I'm honey, if I'm going to be in Capitalism, I wanted to be at Lush So that.
That was really hate.
But I think Clay back to doing theater. I oh, I would love to play like Glinda one day, dying to do a trans legally blonde like a cast of like Twink Delta News. I think would be so fun.
Okay, hello, hello, sweet Charity.
I think could be really fun too.
One.
That's a great one. Really.
How was Jenna? I know you did Waitress right?
I did? It was the best.
How did it? How did it feel to go from doing you know, performances on television to that?
Yeah?
So I had started in theater as well. I was in and I when I was nine on Broadway, and then I did Spring and Spring Awakening on Broadway when Graf and Lee were in it, and then half split, so I joined while they were in it and then they left, and then I had the new cast as well. So I was in both casts right before Lee literally booked Glee out of Smer awakening, but to return to the return to the stage after doing so many years of Glee was like it was weird and scary because it had been such a long time, but it was literally the best. One of my favorite experiences of all time was doing Waitress.
Like there's a.
Few things that I I you would have asked me during gly like some of your favorite artists. It had been Sarah Burellis and like, what is the next thing you want to you was a Broadway musical, so like I got both again and like it was just it was literally the best.
Like Sarah was there, Lisey pinched me.
She helped design like the speakers on the stage as like an artist that we could hear better, Like with the sound so the band was coming through the stage, You're like, God, bless you. The mics were like crafted so that you didn't have to work that hard for her music. It was just so nice.
It was the best. I think about that a lot.
And then Kevin surprised me actually and came and saw it and texted me at half hour, which I'll never do to anybody.
Really, I didn't. You can do that. Some people like it, some people don't. It was a big day.
It's like a lot of people there for me, so I just like it added to like the nerves.
But Kevin was like, good luck, have a great time.
At your show, and like a selfie of him like in front of the Marque.
I didn't know he was in New York or anything. So it was great. It was really fun. She was so good. I was nervous.
I was watching her because I had never seen her perform in that way, and so I was sitting in my chair like I had my mouth.
I was nervous.
Yeah again, but Kevin, what is on your Broadway vision board?
Well, Kevin is doing like this is the year of the musical for Kevin.
Yeah.
I did my first theater thing last year, yes, spelling bee. And then I'm going to London to dude.
I'm doing a concert called we Aren't Kids Anymore The Savoy but the Savoy.
Oh my gosh, is going to be a The Savoy soon? Oh my god, it's good. Oh it's going to end. Yeah wait, that's exciting that But west End, everyone Brittain loved. British men are so jealous. You guys are going to London like I can't. I'm actually like so jealous.
This mads me like I was already happy and excited, but this just really beside myself.
But say something weird. I almost like I would love to become like a West End diva, even maybe over a broad I love.
That for you. Yes, can you do that? I did a g I did a gay cruise. This last like.
That.
I went on the gay cruise and I wrote the show for three days. What I will say is there was a little bit of like, oh, like, do should I be taking this gig? Like I just I don't know. And then I had went to a dinner with Patty lapone like a week later, and I was like, Patty, I was just on this gay cruise. She goes, Oh, I do those all the time. She goes, those are my favorite gigs. And I was like, oh thank god.
I was like, look, Patty of Ru, do you do it?
You show right? Yes in New York, Little Cam.
I feel like I like the Broadway divas the show.
I feel like if Glee was running right now, I maybe would have made a cameo wall Oh.
Oh you would have had a full part. Yeah, I forget it. You would have had an arc. You know what you have sang something musical theater, right, not pop like music.
Would have had to be musical theater, and I think it would have been Oh.
Oh, that's the hardest question, you know.
I feel like I feel like going along with Sweet Charity, like you would have Deald multiple numbers on our show obviously, so like I feel like we could have had like a big Spender number with all the girls, like we could bring Sugar back and do it, and you could have actually properly done it. We've done songs on the show multiple times.
I will say my favorite Glee sort of like to like Nor I still listen to this day is Christian Chenowick's house is not a home or maybe.
This times literally you I'm not kidding. That's Kelly's favorite size of the show. He will listen to that on repeat. Us in London, just like Walking on the River.
You guys know, there's a new London.
I don't know if it's new, but it's a nice crisis in London bar that's like a musically I thought online, I'll find it for you, but apparently.
There's like a full Broadway musical bar. I'm so jealous, you guys.
And you know what you know what we're gonna sing at that bar? I do house is not a home.
Oh my god, your words? Ready to go? Your pink suitcase, Kevin, I'm you have to wait? You have you have a pink suitcase? Yes? The new away bags that are wait? Do you two?
I'm so mad at you no, because I emailed a way about a month ago and I was like, can I get some suitcases? They only had the silver gla I was like, I really want pink, but I'll take the silver glitter. I got the silver glitter. Two weeks later, the pink ones come out. Oh other fun fact that I have to tell you, I auditioned for Young Kurt back in the day and.
And are you ready? Are you ready? I'm ready?
Guess what other character I auditioned for.
I'm it was.
It Young Kurt and it was another part in that episode few years later, Young No Young.
Not Young Apart.
A few years later Young Kurt was like season two right, I want to hold your hand, right, I'm gonna get this.
It was Jake Puckerman. I want to let that sit, I want to let that sit sweating. Yeah, I might I might be. I was going to say, I might be the only one that auditioned for both Young Kert and Cake. But what I definitely confirm is I'm the only trans woman that auditioned for both Young Kurt and Jake Puckerman made for you. I'm not okay, I'm I'm obsessed without being like the first or the only of like many different I'm trying to get to be the first trans person to space right now, and that's the whole thing in itself. But I can confidently say on this one that that was correct. I had this manager that scouted me from high school musical Junior, and she was very like Joey's agent from Friends, and the amount of times where it was like You're gonna be amazing, and and like she well, because I had gone in for Young Kurt, and then I was like a little too old. I did look shockingly like Chris pre transition, and I do think there's also maybe something about me and Chris playing siblings in something one day on like a road trip comedy that feels like that feels.
Like maybe a twenty five vision board thing, thank you.
But then when the Jake audition comes around, I like it was very obvious that the casting directors were not like remember that kid that we saw for young Kurt, We gotta get that one in here. This woman was like all right, like who knows if she even got me the proper audition. She told me to show up at this place and you had me hijacking things left and right. And I was probably like fifteen or sixteen, but I had paid like an online school for like an illegal diploma that I had graduated high school so that I could even audition for these things. And I remember going in there and because I think his whole thing was that he had to like play guitar, and like there was like maybe some like sports or you know, something like that, and I just like, th do you play guitar? I'm like no, And then they're like any sports background? Not really now, And then I was probably like, I mean, who knows. I was probably like blackbirds singing, like like there.
Did you have to sing?
Or no?
The yeah, I think I had to sing for the audition.
Do you remember what you're saying? That's what I'm trouble.
It's giving either blackbird or it's giving.
Blackbird for sure, but wow.
Yeah, Well, what was your feeling about auditioning for Glee? Like that's a big one if you're a fan of the show. Right like that, it was like fifteen years.
I mean, I was like, this is it, you know what? I also the lore of the Glee musical that was coming to Broadway for many years. I mean that almost kept me from transitioning because I was like, well, there's one.
Role that I as a man, and it was current Humble on Broadway, right right, I was.
I was in that my mom's office computer room, singing those songs ready to go whenever. And in some ways I'm still waiting and maybe if there was a role to still a d transition for, it's that one. We're still waiting.
Your lips to Ryan's ears.
Yeah, literally, how about did you know anything about that musical?
We had heard the words of it, but it never it never got pasted, literally like people talking about it, not not Ryan, not anybody. We just had heard, like I mean, there might be a musical. That one playbill article.
Was enough to fuel me for like six years.
That's probably.
I mean, that was enough to like make me an audition for like musical theater colleges. Like I was like, well, there's always the Glee musical.
Maybe that's crazy. That's another one at it to sweet Chair, it.
Wouldn't have been crazy though, like that, it feels like a very plausible thing at the time.
I will say, I will say Kevin, like my if I was to do a vision board right after we end this call and I put the Glee musical, like my manifestation skills are so good, it might happen, and I'm just nervous for all of us.
That's oh my god, Yeah, you on them for us.
Jake Spickerman, I can't with that. That's never going to leave my mind.
And funnily enough, the guy who played Jake Puckerman did get into Juilliard.
For Dan. That's what we really messed. That's what we really messed.
And I mean our lives will look so differently. We would know each other in very different contexts.
Yeah, we would wow about Glee.
Obviously you you loved Kurt. There was like a kinship there. Tell me about like obviously the musical theater thing as well. But what else about the show kept you watching? And what about the show did you like hate watch any of it any of it or like, were there like unhitch storylines that you felt like were just like.
I talked till the end.
I was, oh my god, you're like, you're the person who watched the rest of the show.
It was me. But what is weird is that like the Josie you know Mayron where I forget what her character's name was, that like slipped my mind completely because like I was, that's where it really gets to the end.
There you're like, what did you do? Sure?
But what I loved was like how it was raunchy, Like there was so many things that like I think my mom thought it was going over my head that it didn't. And during the time, like I was that twelve year old that was like reading Chelsea Handler like books and similar, Yeah, it's scary. And I think that I really, like I was obsessed with any time you guys were talking about sex or you know, I was even this morning, I was putting make up on. I was watching like the Sectionals episode, and I was like, wow, we're like going And in many ways, there were like some kids that were probably way too young to be watching that that because we're singing don't stop believing, Like sure, I thought it was okay to show your children. Yeah, but I think that it was always this sort of like heightened version of reality. And also I'm such a camp person still, and so my personality is not far off from what that world looks like. And it's still it brought me so much peace because like I and actually I feel like I missed that from TV still these days. Is that like that really heightened dramatic sort of like but there was still so much sweetness there and there was it wasn't past the point of not being able to get vulnerable. And and I think that that's what is sad about television now that's like either really dry humor or you know, not a musical number to be seen. It's sort of like why it was so valuable like it was. It was first Lee and then Smash was another huge one in my rolodex. But I think that had it makes me sad thinking that like the younger generation right now doesn't have that like theater kid pipeline TV show. What is that right now?
I don't know. Maybe it was a high school musical TV show.
Okay, there's what we love, we love.
Yeah, but yeah, you're right, there's and it walked that fine line, which I think is sort of like Ryan's whole bag of like being really satirical and like dark humor, and there was always space, like you said, Dylan, that you could always get grounded and have something really meaningful happen. And being able to do that in the same episode is crazy. And it always happened, and it always worked, and we always bought it.
Yes, And it's a red flag for me when people say that they can't enjoy that, or like once somebody starts singing, they like completely check out right. I had people that went to see the Wicked film and they're like, I loved all the parts except when they sang, and I was like that to me, like death, Like I like, it's it's a Wendy Williams, Like you know.
Just like nope.
I think that, like the the art of like figuring out how to get into a musical number in an acting bee is so funny and it.
Didn't always work, you know, like sometimes it works better than others. And I think like with Wicked and when Glee or any musical is at its best is when those songs are advancing the story and explaining things the characters feeling that they can't explain through regular words, And like, how can I.
Even feel that can I even go as far as I feel like the musical theater on the show did the best job of that, because I feel like the pop songs didn't always tell the full story where it's maybe his time moment, like we're going in so many other places.
Yeah, Journey for sure. I think you're correct.
Yeah, it's on now that we've solved Glee.
What are you listening to? What do you listen to on the regular?
Oh my god, I feel like I let everyone tell, like figure out what the good songs are. I have been listening to a lot of Juno Sabrina Carpenter that I and I listened to the same, like seven songs on repeat.
I'm a looper.
We've got a lot of Gaga going right now, getting ready for Coachella. Oh my god, Perfect Celebrity, Garden of Eden. Oh it's killer, it's so good, Perfect Celebrity. I did get to listen to Abracadabra early early, did so lucky I did.
Does she ever come on the show? No, but but I think she likes it. Yeah, she loves it. Confirmed she yeah, on the Vogue thing. Jenna was in one of her music videos.
She yes, So it's crazy. We did a lot of her music. Obviously, we did episodes for her. Ryan loved her. She was like the hottest of hot at the time. And then the guy that I was dating, his friend whose TV show they were on a TV show together, was dating Gada.
They got engaged and so they were He was like, she.
Was visiting him in Atlanta and I was in Atlanta too, and so he's like, hey, my my girlfriend wants to come out or like Lady Kaka rights like yeah, so she like comes over that.
She can come.
Yeah, she comes over like a rotisserie chicken and like apple sapples, like chicken that he had like eaten a bite of and she's like, I'm so sorry he like eat some of it.
I'm like, I also, you.
Just said Lady Gaga showed up as a rotes stry chicken. I was like, what does that outfit look like?
I would have loved that too, works.
Work for friends game night, It's almost.
She showed up as a rottach.
Is what got cut for the VMEs?
But yeah, then exactly how did you end up in the And then so we were just chatting, we like became like buds.
That night we all went out to a bar, like so much fun. It was awesome.
And then I guess I was like on her mind and she was talking about her in music video that she was directing.
It was married the night.
And then like a couple of days later, I got a call and they're like, Gaga, I wants like to know if you want to be in a music video.
She's directing this her first, it's her directorial debut. I was like yes. I was like, but there's a slight problem. I'm shooting Glee and we don't stop working. So she called Ryan and was like, hey.
Ryan, I would ask if you could release Jenna for these two days so that she could come and do my music video.
It's like yeah, whatever, sure.
And so nobody gets out to do nobody, but Lady Gaga calls Ryan. You know you get out, and so Ryan get graciously like let me out to go do it. So I did two days on her music video and it's very brief and like it was a full movie in the music video that like you didn't get to see, like nobody saw it, but we shot like a full short film in her in like in a set apartment that like and then like you literally catch me if you pause it and look at the far end of the actual edit.
But but I was.
There, Okay, I'm actually putting on my vision board is to see the short film that was.
Oh I want to see that.
I was gonna say, I'm nervous, Like I was like, should I just text her and ask for to like maybe get that on her plate? And there's like can you imagine getting ready for Coachella and like this crazy world tour and it's like some trans girl being.
Like, Hi, can we please see them Marry the Night video.
I was just talking to my friend on a podcast and she we didn't get to see that Clinton, So if you could take time to do that when you're not rehearsal would be great in your busy schedule.
Thank you so much. Can you take a picture of yourself as a registery chick and thank you?
But if her an idea, you know that's no.
I know You're welcome, Goga, You're just so you got like that with GAA. You guys text.
We are texting, and we're on a tensing basis that she's an ally.
She she's for the dolls on every she is saying it from the rooftops like she's using her full chest and she gets that. I mean, I think that's kind of what we need right now.
Yes, yes, it's so scared, especially I think just in this industry now, people are scared of like what does it mean to, you know, hire a transperson, even a queer person. At this point, there's this like fear and I don't know what pride looks like, and I don't know what the kind of bigger picture looks like. But I at least know the people in my life and in my circle and the ones that I can depend on. She's one of them, and I feel so lucky that. I mean that also, honestly, meet your heroes like that, like that is what I There's very few people that I admired that did not live up to what my young Dylan thought. Coating being with the two of you right now, I mean, it's so cool.
You're cool, are you? You're cool?
Like I know, you probably didn't sign up for TikTok thinking you were going to be, you know, a gigantic role model or millions of people's I don't know, and maybe only experience of like seeing a trans person like live happily in the ups and downs. And like, but here you are, like that's no small responsibility whether you and you've done it in a way that I don't know how. I don't know how you have, but like you're here so kind every time I see you, yours always kind, And I know you have long days. You're getting it all the time from people, the good and the bad. But and you're handling it like you are crushing it.
We are so lucky.
We're so lucky to be doing what it is we love and have gotten to these experiences. I think it's because I'm camp that I can get through because there is like I'm like, oh I took a beer company down that's camp. Like oh I just get a gay cruise, that's camp. You know, there's like if you can't find the hilarity in the darkness of what we're all living through, then I just don't know the point.
You're right, You're so right.
Can we talk about this book for a second, because that's a hard journey in itself?
Like what was the what was the process for the book? How was it? Did you enjoy it? Was it hard? Was?
I think what's weird is going from uh, like every single day making a new thing putting it out there, seeing how the world responded, and then waking up the next day and doing it again. It was so conflicting because I was like, what do you mean, I can't put the book out tomorrow?
And in a way that process right right totally.
But that really freaked me out because I was like, Okay, I'm signing up for this thing that will come out in like three years from now, and.
I didn't know.
I was scared because I was like, I don't know what that looks like. And it ended up being a really great thing. Because I thought the book was going to be one thing. Then beer Gate happened and I grew up so much and it became another. I think the one piece of it that makes me slightly like uncomfortable is the fact that, like I this is these are my twenty five year old words, and I feel like a little slightly different, you know. It's a little more earnest than I am now, And I'm starting to try to let that just be like a gift of like, oh, how how great that that's a time stamp of that chapter. But I think that in a way, because of all the dark parts of what have happened in the last three years having somewhere to put it that wasn't the Internet that felt safer. Did you guys, Like, at what point did you realize the Internet, like when you were doing the show was like kind of becoming as big as it did. Like with with your relationship to the social media.
Yeah, what we we started really at like the advent of Twitter. It was like twine. Twitter sort of blew up, and that's what we did. And so it started off as like a really positive I would say, the first season and a half ye, and it started to mirror what Ryan had always told us about, you know, if we are lucky enough to have success, it's great, and they're going to build us up, but just at some point they're going to tear you down. And I think having in the back of our minds one having no previous interaction with social media in that way, because my Space was not like that. Facebook was not like that. Like I was on Facebook when you had to get an invite to get on Facebook, right wow, And so like that's what we were used to in terms of social media, and I don't even think there was the term social media at the time.
And so.
I think our relationship to it. It felt really fun and really positive at the beginning, right where like you could that instant gratification and like you were meeting people who were so excited about the thing you were a part of is so nice and reaffirming and gratifying. That like being able to interact people like that was unbelievable and it still is.
That is like the best thing.
But it is scary, I think when you know people do turn on you or when the wrong people find you, because then people feel like they've got a direct line yes, and that can be really dangerous because I think what ended up happening was sort of this like, oh, oh my gosh, I'm including everyone in my life and I'm showing them my personal you know, vulnerabilities both internal and external, and then people start to feel like they have a right to that and so so hard to scale back. It's so hard to redefine boundaries with parasocial relationships. And what is weird too is I always thought that like maybe people would know me as like a character that I eventually played, But people really feel like they know me, and which is such a compliment because that means they like, you know, the idea of who I even though I have a thousand other parts to myself. But I think that did people project, especially like through social media and starting to get to know you. Was there any part of them that was like frustrated when you weren't living up to like the character that they had built in their heads around you.
Yeah, yes, yeah, I think it started. That's right, Kevin has started really positive. And then I feel really lucky honestly because we were at the dawn. We weren't in the height, you know, or like the explosion of Instagram where like stories started to come out like that was after we were off and that really fast, like I know what her house looks, like, I know where she is all the time kind of feeling wasn't there when we were on Glee and we were really just like telling vogging from like set, so it felt really safe in a way.
Where As like as.
We started to as it started to the time started to go on, like towards the end, we started to see like battles between fans over things, fighting within each other and cyberbullying and all of that. It was like really rude and terrible, but it didn't happen until later. And I think we also got a lot of like like I didn't write the show, but like they would hate us for storylines and hate us for things that we did to other characters and things that we said.
And then it started to just really snowballs.
And then what like I built my entire thing on like telling everyone everything and being honest and all this stuff. But then you realize when then you're in a place whether you're behind a contract or it's literally not your place to speak on certain things and people are demanding things of you, we were like, wait, this doesn't even fall under my jurisdiction, yes, or I legally cannot tell you this thing. And yet that that's what's I think crazy. I give so much more grace to anyone that's putting themselves out there, whether it's in the public eye or they're writing a book or they have a podcast, because it is it's weird to and it's scary to put yourself out there. And it doesn't mean.
That everybody gets like a right to everything.
Then like, and I do think you're right, Like I feel like people really do feel like because you are, this comes with the territory.
That's what people would say.
It's kind of like becoming famous on a show when you're an actor, and they're like, it comes with the territory. They should just know that if they're getting interrupted during dinner or they're interrupted while shopping or walking outside, like that's what they signed up for.
Actually it's not. It's not what we signed that for.
Can can I ask a question?
Yeah that's the way?
Okay, I just started a podcast. It's called The Dylan Hour, and yeah, thank you. I find myself over sharing in really crazy ways on like on podcasts, where I'm like and then I get done with them, I'm like, whoa, how did that just happen? How how do you guys with this what we're doing right now? Like where are you? Like, have you defined what your boundaries are before you even go into you know, making all these episodes, or how does that work for you guys as podcast hosts?
Great question. We sort of deal with it as it comes. I think luckily because Jenna and I, I mean had almost the exact same experience. We're part of the exact same thing where we have that check and knowledge and foundational like friendship to be able to tell what's cool to say publicly and what's not.
I always like to sell to Kevin though, like there's a rule like it's not my story to tell, so if it involves one of our other cast members, I just say, it's not our story. Yeah.
There's been a couple of times where I'm like, Okay, well this thing actually happened behind the scenes and I don't know, and she's like no. I'm also not one who likes headlines are like attention like that, Like I'm not trying to you know, I want our podcasts to do well, and I want all of that, but I don't want like the Aden way. Yeah, And I think it's like we come from a place where this show and this podcast is about explaining the narrative from our perspective and only we can tell it from our perspective. And it's positive and it's light, and there was challenges, and there was dark times and tragedy and friendship and fights and like all of the truths that happened when you were in a family.
But the reality is like the headlines that you're reading about the rivals and all of the crap that you read, it's like a zero zero one percent compared to all the good things that happened to us.
On the show and our relationships.
And so I think we kind of lead with the positivity and just really laying down the narrative that like this, this is what was true, this is what was true, and then like the rest kind of comes and like we kind of just.
Exactly exactly. And I think that's maybe what we have in common.
It's like trying to always lead with the positive and the truth, and I think it's it makes me sad that so much of what media has become is for the clickbait, where you know, they want the drama, they want to they want to see people, you know, hurting, they're hurting others, and I think that's what I don't ever want to prescribe to. And I think you are both like iconic hosts for making people feel so comfortable on here and.
Well you're a great interview by the way, So I have thank you.
I have in the world that you're going to be a great podcast as well.
Oh yeah, you're just the best. There's nothing really that you haven't set your mind to that you've tried to do and have not just crushed it.
He The one thing is I really wish Jenna would come to London.
Oh gosh, I have a small new small child. I know, so sadly, I don't think they get to London this. What about a little bit by Ones.
Jenna, I'll buy what severalby ones you want?
Yes, I will. I mean I would love that. Yes, I will that. He would be really cute.
Yeah, he would good coloring for that.
I would love that. No, you guys have the best time in London.
Okay, before we let you go, Dylan, we have to know what is the feeling that.
Glee leaves you with.
Mmm. I think it's like, this is crazy infinite femininity, because yes, when I think about me dancing to like rag Doll, or like say a little prayer, or like in my living room like as a kid, Like sure, there was plenty of other storylines in there, but it was the femininity within the show that helped me survive and get to my womanhood and ultimately, like, so much of who I am now is still that kid that was like dancing in my living room that to your show and so and I think it's infinite because it has gotten me this far and it's going to keep getting me to the next and where me and Kevin are still listening to houses, not a home, so this really could be infinite and beyond it.
Oh it is, that's right. We celebrate it. We celebrate the femininity.
And I.
My eyes were starting to have moisture in them. That was really beautiful.
And thank you for sharing that, and thank you for being on here and being so willing to talk about Glee in depth and share so much of yourself with us. I know you get pulled in a million directions, so it means a lot that. Yeah, as much time.
I haven't enjoyed doing this more than just about any other press thing that I've gotten for this book. And we made all the way through not one trans people in sports question.
No, we promised.
That's for that's for my comeback episode.
That's the title You're welcome only talking about. It's thirty seconds long and it's just about in sports.
Oh well, thank you, thank you so much again for for just being with us.
It's really such pleasure.
I can't wait to see you in person, both of you. I'll text you. I'll text you, Yeah, text me.
Go listen to Dylan's podcast, Go by Dylan's book, like come on, it's you do.
On stage.
See both of us on stage in London Fair.
Yes, yeah, I love you both, love you so much, love you bye?
What did I tell you? I mean you were right? Wow.
Dylan is the gift that keeps on giving. What a light for so many people, for me, for us, She's just the the realist.
And what a great hombo. Love her, love her? Yeah, I mean, did you make it very Chris's inner circle. It's pretty good. You're vouched for it. That's like vouching the highest honor. Good person, good advocate stands for good things, integrity, funny, like smart, charming, like lovely, really really wonderful.
Diagram that she's got going on of friendship, you know, like guy Chris.
Yeah, and also like I want her to make my vision board?
Wow? Yeah, can we have a vision board party? Maybe that's what we should.
Do, Kevin, let's do that off New Year's unless you're going somewhere else for New Year's.
Let's do it. Okay, Okay, have you made a vision board for this year?
No?
I tend to write down words and lists, but I really only made words for this one.
But I mean, like, okay, I'll talk to Dylan. Maybe we'll just do like a visual party as vision board party let's do it.
That sounds fun. Okay great. Thanks for joining us, and that's what you really missed by.
Thanks for listening, and follow us on Instagram at and that's what you really miss pod. Make sure to write us a review and leave us five stars. See you next time.
