Speaks to the Plannet.

Speaks to the Plannet.

I'll go by the name of Charlamagne the God. And guess what, I can't wait to see y'all at the third annual Black Effect Podcast Festival. That's right, We're coming back to Atlanta, Georgia, Saturday, April twenty six at Poeman Yards and it's hosted by none other than Decisions, Decisions May Be Be and Weezy. Okay, we got the R and B Money podcast. We're taking Jay Valentine. We got the Woman of All Podcasts with Sarah Jake Roberts. We got Good Mom's Bad Choices. Carrie Champion will be there with her next sports podcast, and the Trap Nerds podcast, with more to be announced. And of course it's bigger than podcasts. We're bringing the Black Effect marketplace with black owned businesses, plus the food truck court to keep you fed while you visit us. All right, listen, you don't want to miss this. Tap in and grab your tickets now at Black Effect dot Com Flash Podcast.

I'll go by the name of Charlamagne the God. And guess what, I can't wait to see y'all at the third annual Black Effect Podcast Festival. That's right, We're coming back to Atlanta, Georgia, Saturday, April twenty six at Poeman Yards and it's hosted by none other than Decisions, Decisions May Be Be and Weezy. Okay, we got the R and B Money podcast. We're taking Jay Valentine. We got the Woman of All Podcasts with Sarah Jake Roberts. We got Good Mom's Bad Choices. Carrie Champion will be there with her next sports podcast, and the Trap Nerds podcast, with more to be announced. And of course it's bigger than podcasts. We're bringing the Black Effect marketplace with black owned businesses, plus the food truck court to keep you fed while you visit us. All right, listen, you don't want to miss this. Tap in and grab your tickets now at Black Effect dot Com Flash Podcast.

Festival All Star twenty twenty five, San Francisco. Jack has been a good run, but I don't think there was any way we could have expected to have this as our closing interview. Yeah, I was excited. I couldn't wait. I gotta thank Dana Pump. I've been knowing Dana since I was fourteen, the biggest hustler in the world, him and his brothers. He called me like a week and a half ago. He's like, Matt, I think I got Barry, Like Barry who because either Barry Sanders or Barry Bonds.

Festival All Star twenty twenty five, San Francisco. Jack has been a good run, but I don't think there was any way we could have expected to have this as our closing interview. Yeah, I was excited. I couldn't wait. I gotta thank Dana Pump. I've been knowing Dana since I was fourteen, the biggest hustler in the world, him and his brothers. He called me like a week and a half ago. He's like, Matt, I think I got Barry, Like Barry who because either Barry Sanders or Barry Bonds.

I'm like, I don't believe you. He's like, no, I promise you.

I'm like, I don't believe you. He's like, no, I promise you.

He's like, hit this lady, and I hit Lisa and we hit it off and now man, welcome to the show.

He's like, hit this lady, and I hit Lisa and we hit it off and now man, welcome to the show.

Barry Bonds man. You Yeah, I'm.

Barry Bonds man. You Yeah, I'm.

Seven time MVP, fourteen time All Star, eight Gold Gloves, all time leader, and home runs single season home run leader, the greatest baseball player of all time.

Seven time MVP, fourteen time All Star, eight Gold Gloves, all time leader, and home runs single season home run leader, the greatest baseball player of all time.

When you hear that, what comes to your mind.

When you hear that, what comes to your mind.

I don't really talk about it. I let my peers talk about it. I always tell people, are you good at something?

I don't really talk about it. I let my peers talk about it. I always tell people, are you good at something?

They'll talk about it.

They'll talk about it.

You don't need to say anything.

You don't need to say anything.

So I don't really talk about it. I know statistically where I am. I don't need to explain it. I'd rather just help the young generation and give you the information that was given me teacher.

So I don't really talk about it. I know statistically where I am. I don't need to explain it. I'd rather just help the young generation and give you the information that was given me teacher.

As much as I know.

As much as I know.

And then you.

And then you.

Know, I always tell people always ask me, like how you do it? I'm like, just stay around long enough for someone to talk about you. That's pretty much is just don't be a commercial, right, you know, if you want to be really good at something, you just you don't have to be doing it a long time.

Know, I always tell people always ask me, like how you do it? I'm like, just stay around long enough for someone to talk about you. That's pretty much is just don't be a commercial, right, you know, if you want to be really good at something, you just you don't have to be doing it a long time.

Well obviously very humble about your success, but do you ever kind of look back and at the stuff you've accomplished in some of the records that will never be touched, Like do you think, like, hey, like when I was playing, I was, I really did it at the highest level I do.

Well obviously very humble about your success, but do you ever kind of look back and at the stuff you've accomplished in some of the records that will never be touched, Like do you think, like, hey, like when I was playing, I was, I really did it at the highest level I do.

I look back and it's different.

I look back and it's different.

I have this, you know, like you talk about Michael Jordan, you can talk our IQ is like way up here, tiger.

I have this, you know, like you talk about Michael Jordan, you can talk our IQ is like way up here, tiger.

You know, it's just so high.

You know, it's just so high.

And I think for myself, I look back at the gifts that God blessed me with, and then I look back at the hard work that I put into it, and then I try to find ways of how do I give this to someone else, or how do I teach this or how do you pass this on? And why do I see it? But you don't you know what I mean? It's it's this battle that you play with yourself all the time, and then how can I articulate that to somebody else? And then they give you, well, why, well, why does this work?

And I think for myself, I look back at the gifts that God blessed me with, and then I look back at the hard work that I put into it, and then I try to find ways of how do I give this to someone else, or how do I teach this or how do you pass this on? And why do I see it? But you don't you know what I mean? It's it's this battle that you play with yourself all the time, and then how can I articulate that to somebody else? And then they give you, well, why, well, why does this work?

Or why did you do this?

Or why did you do this?

And and you know, my brain points right here in front of you, but you you know, and how do you not see it? And so I look back at ways of how for myself would I be able to you know, articulate this to somebody else and give this gift that I was blessed with. And then you know, and hopefully he'll give it to somebody else.

And and you know, my brain points right here in front of you, but you you know, and how do you not see it? And so I look back at ways of how for myself would I be able to you know, articulate this to somebody else and give this gift that I was blessed with. And then you know, and hopefully he'll give it to somebody else.

Greg Maddix once said, best hitter I've ever faced. Trevor Hoffman said, the most dangerous hitter in baseball history, the big Unit. One of the most amazing players ever. A Hall of fameer, no doubt. A lot of guys. Again, you stick around long enough, they'll talk about you. But when it's from your peers, your contemporary, the guys you went to battle with you're in year out. Is that is that more satisfying to you?

Greg Maddix once said, best hitter I've ever faced. Trevor Hoffman said, the most dangerous hitter in baseball history, the big Unit. One of the most amazing players ever. A Hall of fameer, no doubt. A lot of guys. Again, you stick around long enough, they'll talk about you. But when it's from your peers, your contemporary, the guys you went to battle with you're in year out. Is that is that more satisfying to you?

Yeah?

Yeah?

That's that's that's important. Yeah, it's I mean, you can't get any better than that. I mean, just like in basketball, it's like I hear Michael George's name all the time. You know, you hear those names, and and when you have your peers talk about you, and you know, that's just the top of the list. There's there's no other list greater than that. I don't care who you are, what you are. If you have your peers talking about you, you did something.

That's that's that's important. Yeah, it's I mean, you can't get any better than that. I mean, just like in basketball, it's like I hear Michael George's name all the time. You know, you hear those names, and and when you have your peers talk about you, and you know, that's just the top of the list. There's there's no other list greater than that. I don't care who you are, what you are. If you have your peers talking about you, you did something.

Well, we're here now for NBA All Star Were you here in two thousand for the All Star Game?

Well, we're here now for NBA All Star Were you here in two thousand for the All Star Game?

Evince No I watched ons I watched.

Evince No I watched ons I watched.

Yeah, that was one of the best ones.

Yeah, that was one of the best ones.

Were you close to any NBA players in your time?

Were you close to any NBA players in your time?

Jordan and I kind of came up together. We were in Chicago and Jordan first came in league. We used to hang out in Chicago all the time. He was at the Bulls and stuff.

Jordan and I kind of came up together. We were in Chicago and Jordan first came in league. We used to hang out in Chicago all the time. He was at the Bulls and stuff.

And like that. Two of the.

And like that. Two of the.

Great I tell you, Michael Jordan was before he even became the most famous person ever. Him tired and we were in Chicago and he was just I mean, he's only two years older than I am, you know, And we went out to just to grab a bite to eat. And I ain't never seen a line of people that wanted to just talk to this guy. And I was just coming up too, so I was rookie, so nobody knew who I was, you know, it was just Bobbie Bond's son, nobody at the time. And I thought I was pretty big at the time because I made it. But Michael had all these people, and he had had a couple of security guys there watching. Michael was so nice. He was just signing auto grass when We're trying to grab something to eat, and I'm over here going I'm Barry Hello. You know what it's like to have some like that good, you know what I mean, And for that one moment, I'm like, I want to be like Mike one day, you know, when you really see it from the very beginning.

Great I tell you, Michael Jordan was before he even became the most famous person ever. Him tired and we were in Chicago and he was just I mean, he's only two years older than I am, you know, And we went out to just to grab a bite to eat. And I ain't never seen a line of people that wanted to just talk to this guy. And I was just coming up too, so I was rookie, so nobody knew who I was, you know, it was just Bobbie Bond's son, nobody at the time. And I thought I was pretty big at the time because I made it. But Michael had all these people, and he had had a couple of security guys there watching. Michael was so nice. He was just signing auto grass when We're trying to grab something to eat, and I'm over here going I'm Barry Hello. You know what it's like to have some like that good, you know what I mean, And for that one moment, I'm like, I want to be like Mike one day, you know, when you really see it from the very beginning.

But he was so he was already.

But he was so he was already.

Large before k became larger than anything. And I will always remember that he was. He was always like, come on, b let's go. And you know, and it was good because we've we've always been like really you know, good friends, and even at a distance, you know now that you know his profession's gone to where it's gone and you've got distance, we even if we talk and we haven't talked in a long time, like we talked to thinks like last year we had a conversation not too long ago, and it always seems like we've never.

Large before k became larger than anything. And I will always remember that he was. He was always like, come on, b let's go. And you know, and it was good because we've we've always been like really you know, good friends, and even at a distance, you know now that you know his profession's gone to where it's gone and you've got distance, we even if we talk and we haven't talked in a long time, like we talked to thinks like last year we had a conversation not too long ago, and it always seems like we've never.

Missed a beat. And that's what that's what's really good about.

Missed a beat. And that's what that's what's really good about.

Yeah, I got a question, I mean with We talked to Kobe about Mike, and Kobe said every aspect dealing with Mike was competitive and maybe that's because that was a young guy trying to catch him.

Yeah, I got a question, I mean with We talked to Kobe about Mike, and Kobe said every aspect dealing with Mike was competitive and maybe that's because that was a young guy trying to catch him.

Was everything with you, Gus?

Was everything with you, Gus?

Was it more just a genuine conversation friendship or was there some competitiveness even in the conversation.

Was it more just a genuine conversation friendship or was there some competitiveness even in the conversation.

We played two different fields, so two different.

We played two different fields, so two different.

Well he tried, he tried to come to your field.

Well he tried, he tried to come to your field.

Well, that wasn't gonna happen. I mean, I love Mike, but that wasn't gone.

Well, that wasn't gonna happen. I mean, I love Mike, but that wasn't gone.

Now, do you have actual advice baseball?

Now, do you have actual advice baseball?

No, I got never asked him advice and basketball. I knew he was that good, and you know, but uh.

No, I got never asked him advice and basketball. I knew he was that good, and you know, but uh.

We always joked around with I mean, we had always a great respect for each other. I think Michael's I saw Michael the same thing he probably saw me that this iq of vision of you know, the type of players we were, and you know, like with my career, you know, I took a little bit from everyone. I mean, the greatest of the greats become they kind of like steal gifts from other people, and you're able to create your stuff, you know, like Tony Gwnn here, Pete Rose here, you know, William May's here, Hank Aaron there, and you know, we're able to see all these qualities in each individual player, and then you kind of invent yourself. I just wanted to be a great hitter. I knew I had power, I knew I could do certain things. But my dad, I'd always told me, you know, be a great hitter. Don't chase the fence. Chase the fence. You're going to lose. Be a great hitter. And that's that's all I.

We always joked around with I mean, we had always a great respect for each other. I think Michael's I saw Michael the same thing he probably saw me that this iq of vision of you know, the type of players we were, and you know, like with my career, you know, I took a little bit from everyone. I mean, the greatest of the greats become they kind of like steal gifts from other people, and you're able to create your stuff, you know, like Tony Gwnn here, Pete Rose here, you know, William May's here, Hank Aaron there, and you know, we're able to see all these qualities in each individual player, and then you kind of invent yourself. I just wanted to be a great hitter. I knew I had power, I knew I could do certain things. But my dad, I'd always told me, you know, be a great hitter. Don't chase the fence. Chase the fence. You're going to lose. Be a great hitter. And that's that's all I.

Wanted to do.

Wanted to do.

So I had to take Tony Gwenn as a great hitter, p Rose at a great hitter, Rod carw and I had to take contact hitters because I could hit the long ball, but I was striking out a lot when I was younger, and I had to close that gap. And so my dad always told me, we're going to think you don't do well son. Things you do well, you always gravitate to that. If you can bring twenty percent or thirty percent or ten percent of what you don't do well, that increases what you do well, so it kind of balances them together.

So I had to take Tony Gwenn as a great hitter, p Rose at a great hitter, Rod carw and I had to take contact hitters because I could hit the long ball, but I was striking out a lot when I was younger, and I had to close that gap. And so my dad always told me, we're going to think you don't do well son. Things you do well, you always gravitate to that. If you can bring twenty percent or thirty percent or ten percent of what you don't do well, that increases what you do well, so it kind of balances them together.

You mentioned, I mean Rod Carew, Tony Gwyn, Pete Rose, some of the greatest contact hitters of all time. What were some of the things you watched that they did that you kind of picked.

You mentioned, I mean Rod Carew, Tony Gwyn, Pete Rose, some of the greatest contact hitters of all time. What were some of the things you watched that they did that you kind of picked.

Up on their patients, the way that they can calculate things on the field. I was able to mathematically calculate what a picture can and can't do. Once I can calculate you, then I could beat you, and then it becomes this what is beating him?

Up on their patients, the way that they can calculate things on the field. I was able to mathematically calculate what a picture can and can't do. Once I can calculate you, then I could beat you, and then it becomes this what is beating him?

Right?

Right?

The goal of hitting is it's me and him, and if I can keep that tunnel vision between me and him and forget the goons that are around him, because in theory, my job is just to hit him and be good against him. Understanding the velocity of a pitch just a fastball. So we're just going to use a fastball analysis. Because you have a guy who throws batting practice to you every single day, and he only throws a fastball, right, and he tries to help you be really good, and we screw that up half the time. So I had to figure out how to master batting practice first, because this guy is trying to help me you know, So how do.

The goal of hitting is it's me and him, and if I can keep that tunnel vision between me and him and forget the goons that are around him, because in theory, my job is just to hit him and be good against him. Understanding the velocity of a pitch just a fastball. So we're just going to use a fastball analysis. Because you have a guy who throws batting practice to you every single day, and he only throws a fastball, right, and he tries to help you be really good, and we screw that up half the time. So I had to figure out how to master batting practice first, because this guy is trying to help me you know, So how do.

I can direct that?

I can direct that?

Now?

Now?

I'm going to piece it to speed. Now I have to understand what my swing technique is and then understand the velocity of a pitch and the velossity of the ball. The further the faster it comes to me, the further goes. Right, But I don't change who I am. Right now, if I can focus on him, I already know the speed of a ball off my bat goes a certain speed.

I'm going to piece it to speed. Now I have to understand what my swing technique is and then understand the velocity of a pitch and the velossity of the ball. The further the faster it comes to me, the further goes. Right, But I don't change who I am. Right now, if I can focus on him, I already know the speed of a ball off my bat goes a certain speed.

I don't care how many people over here. I can still squeeze it through you.

I don't care how many people over here. I can still squeeze it through you.

It's not like you're gonna catch every single thing, right, So my job is my victory is to make contact off of him. Once I do that, everything else is out of the equation. Right, So in theory, I win. I really do win, even though the picture's standing on the mount going. I got you out, No, the second basement did a downfielder did?

It's not like you're gonna catch every single thing, right, So my job is my victory is to make contact off of him. Once I do that, everything else is out of the equation. Right, So in theory, I win. I really do win, even though the picture's standing on the mount going. I got you out, No, the second basement did a downfielder did?

Oh?

Oh?

This guy? You were already adequated. So we took all these people off the field. You would lose so much and be really crazy.

This guy? You were already adequated. So we took all these people off the field. You would lose so much and be really crazy.

Right, So now I have to redirect my brain into this tunnel vision of understanding. If I can concentrate enough to me and him, they slowly disappear. But I can't fight two people at once. I can't say, hit the line drive to a short stop or hit the line drive to the outfielder and he made a catch. Now I want to try to beat them both. You can't one on one. I can fight, but I can't fight two on one.

Right, So now I have to redirect my brain into this tunnel vision of understanding. If I can concentrate enough to me and him, they slowly disappear. But I can't fight two people at once. I can't say, hit the line drive to a short stop or hit the line drive to the outfielder and he made a catch. Now I want to try to beat them both. You can't one on one. I can fight, but I can't fight two on one.

I'm going to lose.

I'm going to lose.

So I have to refocus and go right back to here and go, let me try to do that again. Try to do that again, and let me try to do that again. And then my success rate with him and me become better to my favorite because now I'm focused on him, and now his math has to change. And so we're going to play chess constantly. Right, But in theory, there's a lot more to the game than it is. Because he's sixty feet six inches and he has to throw a ball seventeen inch home plate within this gap. Well, lots of physics tell me he can only do it so many times. Even if I just stand there and never sweep, he's only gonna be able to do it so many times. And then mathematically he has to come to where I get the advantage.

So I have to refocus and go right back to here and go, let me try to do that again. Try to do that again, and let me try to do that again. And then my success rate with him and me become better to my favorite because now I'm focused on him, and now his math has to change. And so we're going to play chess constantly. Right, But in theory, there's a lot more to the game than it is. Because he's sixty feet six inches and he has to throw a ball seventeen inch home plate within this gap. Well, lots of physics tell me he can only do it so many times. Even if I just stand there and never sweep, he's only gonna be able to do it so many times. And then mathematically he has to come to where I get the advantage.

It's just that's just.

It's just that's just.

My idea of breakdown.

My idea of breakdown.

He just gave you so many layers of the.

He just gave you so many layers of the.

Yeah, it's just it's just it's hard to explain where my brain goes.

Yeah, it's just it's just it's hard to explain where my brain goes.

You know.

You know.

Have you ever had those computer guys that do all this and you're like going and he looks at you, like, this is a computer one on one?

Have you ever had those computer guys that do all this and you're like going and he looks at you, like, this is a computer one on one?

Are you stupid?

Are you stupid?

Well, that's how my brain was in baseball. I'm like, you know, I'll get the questions like what do you think about so so I'm like, it's April or it's too dude, I don't know, you know, I don't. I don't have that equation. There's so many things that can go wrong and right that I don't get excited. I don't get excited over the first city of a home run. I'm like, you know, okay, we got nine innings. I don't jump enjoy.

Well, that's how my brain was in baseball. I'm like, you know, I'll get the questions like what do you think about so so I'm like, it's April or it's too dude, I don't know, you know, I don't. I don't have that equation. There's so many things that can go wrong and right that I don't get excited. I don't get excited over the first city of a home run. I'm like, you know, okay, we got nine innings. I don't jump enjoy.

You know.

You know.

All I'm doing is focusing on that picture, focusing on the mistake, or focusing on something else that can happen, you know. And that's just how I think rubs people the wrong way, but only why.

All I'm doing is focusing on that picture, focusing on the mistake, or focusing on something else that can happen, you know. And that's just how I think rubs people the wrong way, but only why.

I can do it that works for me.

I can do it that works for me.

For you, that's all that matters.

For you, that's all that matters.

Did you and Mike ever talk about signing to Jordan Brand?

Did you and Mike ever talk about signing to Jordan Brand?

No, we never did that.

No, we never did that.

Was.

Was.

I was with Nike briefly the early part of my career, and then Felix came over to me and offered me a deal of a lifetime. At the time, they went with King Griffy Junior at that time, because Junior came up and he was a kid, and I mean well deserved. I mean it was eighteen years old. You know, his dad was playing, so it was well deserved. And for me, feli came along, they offered me the world and for me at that time, and I was like perfect, And so I mean, I'd love to be with Jordan now, you know, Mike, I'm right here.

I was with Nike briefly the early part of my career, and then Felix came over to me and offered me a deal of a lifetime. At the time, they went with King Griffy Junior at that time, because Junior came up and he was a kid, and I mean well deserved. I mean it was eighteen years old. You know, his dad was playing, so it was well deserved. And for me, feli came along, they offered me the world and for me at that time, and I was like perfect, And so I mean, I'd love to be with Jordan now, you know, Mike, I'm right here.

You know, you know, you know.

You know, you know, you know.

But in nineteen ninety two slam Dunk Contest visit Deon Sanders Chris Carter crazy, how was that hance on you?

But in nineteen ninety two slam Dunk Contest visit Deon Sanders Chris Carter crazy, how was that hance on you?

No, people need to know the truth because that's a damn lie.

No, people need to know the truth because that's a damn lie.

I got lucky as hell, yeah real.

I got lucky as hell, yeah real.

I mean I could slam dunk, but I was just a basic slam dunker. I could go up with one hand. I could go up with two hands, now about it, and barely get up up there.

I mean I could slam dunk, but I was just a basic slam dunker. I could go up with one hand. I could go up with two hands, now about it, and barely get up up there.

Me too.

Me too.

But so with the scenario with it is that I got in to go against Dion. It was just I think it was just the second round, so I was I don't know who I was going against the first round, but so Dion was just really good.

But so with the scenario with it is that I got in to go against Dion. It was just I think it was just the second round, so I was I don't know who I was going against the first round, but so Dion was just really good.

You know, those guys.

You know, those guys.

Could jump out the gym, and Dion just went cuckoo for summer reasons. I got lucky through the ball in the air and it bounced it and I got it, and that was everything I had.

Could jump out the gym, and Dion just went cuckoo for summer reasons. I got lucky through the ball in the air and it bounced it and I got it, and that was everything I had.

I shot that hell out of myself.

I shot that hell out of myself.

Dian already did a great you know, some great moves up there and under his legs or behind his back and everything else, and only had to do is just do the same thing.

Dian already did a great you know, some great moves up there and under his legs or behind his back and everything else, and only had to do is just do the same thing.

But he wanted to get a little bit back.

But he wanted to get a little bit back.

And just like some of the dudes last night at the slam dunk, and he missed it and then that's how I beat him.

And just like some of the dudes last night at the slam dunk, and he missed it and then that's how I beat him.

So the truth is, Dion Sander could out jump me in a heartbeat, you know, and I just got lucky. And then after that it was over. My back was hurting.

So the truth is, Dion Sander could out jump me in a heartbeat, you know, and I just got lucky. And then after that it was over. My back was hurting.

They need to bring that back.

They need to bring that back.

I think that.

I think that.

Was they do.

Was they do.

I think they.

I think they.

Yeah, might come. He took off.

Yeah, might come. He took off.

I've seen a highlight of that. Somehow that came across my feet a couple of days ago. And if you watch that. He's so lucky. You know how you slip off the rim sometimes that he would have killed hisself. He would slipped because he was going so fast and hung and his whole body swung in the throat was like man and thank god he held on that.

I've seen a highlight of that. Somehow that came across my feet a couple of days ago. And if you watch that. He's so lucky. You know how you slip off the rim sometimes that he would have killed hisself. He would slipped because he was going so fast and hung and his whole body swung in the throat was like man and thank god he held on that.

Those high jumpers many different.

Those high jumpers many different.

Obviously Dad played ball.

Obviously Dad played ball.

What are some of your fondest memories going to the ballpark as a child and being a ball boy.

What are some of your fondest memories going to the ballpark as a child and being a ball boy.

My dad was a hitting genius in his head, I mean, and he could hit two.

My dad was a hitting genius in his head, I mean, and he could hit two.

His own personal life is one of gotten away from my father.

His own personal life is one of gotten away from my father.

But his mind was very struck, very very talented and hitting. He could pick a picture apart fast. And he educated me on that. He educated on learning their flaws, learning things. And then Willie was my mentor. Willie Mays was the one. It was great because I had like two people on me, like my dad was my dad who anything I did was never enough for him. And then Willie was like, you did great, I love you. You know my God's So I had balance, So I have basic balance. The guys who work with my dad, like Gary Sheffield, can tell you some really good stories about my dad when he was training with that. So I said Carrie's different. He's really different, because like I could come home and say I hit two home runs and I'm like, Dad, man, you see that. He's like, how many bat you have? I said four? He said, why did you have four? I'm like, he ain't even happy over the two. You know, Willie be like, that's great. He had a good at bats. So it was always good. But my dad was the one who challenged me. When challenged me to a point to where he expected perfection in practice, and practice was very important that my dad wanted perfection. And I'll never forget this. I was in the batting cage with my father and I was swinging the bat and I was jamming myself and I was missing balls, and my dad kept putting in the screen even closer and making it faster, and I go, Dad, I ain't got it, man.

But his mind was very struck, very very talented and hitting. He could pick a picture apart fast. And he educated me on that. He educated on learning their flaws, learning things. And then Willie was my mentor. Willie Mays was the one. It was great because I had like two people on me, like my dad was my dad who anything I did was never enough for him. And then Willie was like, you did great, I love you. You know my God's So I had balance, So I have basic balance. The guys who work with my dad, like Gary Sheffield, can tell you some really good stories about my dad when he was training with that. So I said Carrie's different. He's really different, because like I could come home and say I hit two home runs and I'm like, Dad, man, you see that. He's like, how many bat you have? I said four? He said, why did you have four? I'm like, he ain't even happy over the two. You know, Willie be like, that's great. He had a good at bats. So it was always good. But my dad was the one who challenged me. When challenged me to a point to where he expected perfection in practice, and practice was very important that my dad wanted perfection. And I'll never forget this. I was in the batting cage with my father and I was swinging the bat and I was jamming myself and I was missing balls, and my dad kept putting in the screen even closer and making it faster, and I go, Dad, I ain't got it, man.

It's just so.

It's just so.

I was with my son at this time. He was little, and he said, Nikolai, why don't you stand behind home plate? And he said, good, up there, son, Barry, and I want you to hit. I said, well, my son back there by.

I was with my son at this time. He was little, and he said, Nikolai, why don't you stand behind home plate? And he said, good, up there, son, Barry, and I want you to hit. I said, well, my son back there by.

Are you crazy? He said, then don't let him get hit. I said, bro, this ain't going down like that. And so, and I had just say bro at that time, I say it here, I said, pop.

Are you crazy? He said, then don't let him get hit. I said, bro, this ain't going down like that. And so, and I had just say bro at that time, I say it here, I said, pop.

Dad, love you.

Dad, love you.

I never said that to my father. I said, Nick, like, get off this kide. So my dad said, no, I'm not going to let him get hit. He put a he put a t back there, and he said, in your mind, pretend it's him now.

I never said that to my father. I said, Nick, like, get off this kide. So my dad said, no, I'm not going to let him get hit. He put a he put a t back there, and he said, in your mind, pretend it's him now.

Swing. I've popped every single ball.

Swing. I've popped every single ball.

He played mind games with me, which was which challenged me, which I loved. And I needed him for that. You know, I needed my father for that, and it was the best. He's the best hitting coach, the best. I mean, his mind was just off the chart.

He played mind games with me, which was which challenged me, which I loved. And I needed him for that. You know, I needed my father for that, and it was the best. He's the best hitting coach, the best. I mean, his mind was just off the chart.

Did that ever blur the lines of dad and and trainers slash coach? Because I've trained my kids and I kind of find there's a fine line. I coached my kids and trade my kids, and there's that kind of that fine line, and I walk it and teeter it. As far as being dad and then coach and trainer, Did you ever, like you said, he expected perfection? Did that ever blur the line of dad?

Did that ever blur the lines of dad and and trainers slash coach? Because I've trained my kids and I kind of find there's a fine line. I coached my kids and trade my kids, and there's that kind of that fine line, and I walk it and teeter it. As far as being dad and then coach and trainer, Did you ever, like you said, he expected perfection? Did that ever blur the line of dad?

No? With me, it was different. I accepted him for who he was. I knew who he was.

No? With me, it was different. I accepted him for who he was. I knew who he was.

I knew the challenges I had with my father and I had a choice. It was deal with it or I was going to miss the boat. And you have to see that. As an athlete, you're going to see it. And if you don't see it, then you're not going to be there anyway. And you have to see that. Why is my dad doing this? Why is he challenging me? We're not he's not at home. We're not at home where he's like, say, clean your room up or anything like this. Why is he pushing me? I didn't realize it untill as I was college and going on that. You know, his he was just it was something I needed. It's weird, it's kind of hard to explain, but I needed that. I needed my dad to be just a jerk, you.

I knew the challenges I had with my father and I had a choice. It was deal with it or I was going to miss the boat. And you have to see that. As an athlete, you're going to see it. And if you don't see it, then you're not going to be there anyway. And you have to see that. Why is my dad doing this? Why is he challenging me? We're not he's not at home. We're not at home where he's like, say, clean your room up or anything like this. Why is he pushing me? I didn't realize it untill as I was college and going on that. You know, his he was just it was something I needed. It's weird, it's kind of hard to explain, but I needed that. I needed my dad to be just a jerk, you.

Know what I mean.

Know what I mean.

I needed my dad to challenge me. I needed that because I was so good. I think I would have took advantage of things. If he didn't keep me in my place like he he would knock me down. And all everyone to do was for my godfather and my father to appreciate my career.

I needed my dad to challenge me. I needed that because I was so good. I think I would have took advantage of things. If he didn't keep me in my place like he he would knock me down. And all everyone to do was for my godfather and my father to appreciate my career.

I didn't care about anybody else.

I didn't care about anybody else.

I didn't care about it.

I didn't care about it.

It was none that had to do with fans and none to do with anything it was like I wanted my dad and willing to say I was part of their group, right, because no one really, no one really knows. My godfather Giants here fifty eight, My godfather's here right, My father's in right field, my godfather's in center field, and I play left field. All three of us in the generation played for Samson Giants, and all three of us played in the outfield two together, but apart right. That's always my goal was to.

It was none that had to do with fans and none to do with anything it was like I wanted my dad and willing to say I was part of their group, right, because no one really, no one really knows. My godfather Giants here fifty eight, My godfather's here right, My father's in right field, my godfather's in center field, and I play left field. All three of us in the generation played for Samson Giants, and all three of us played in the outfield two together, but apart right. That's always my goal was to.

Play left field.

Play left field.

And they wanted me to play right field when I was first coming up with Pittsburgh and have this double O seven James Bond like that's a no.

And they wanted me to play right field when I was first coming up with Pittsburgh and have this double O seven James Bond like that's a no.

And I want in my own.

And I want in my own.

Position because I wanted to complete that circle. And then I knew my own talent. I didn't have the arm like WILLI or my dad did.

Position because I wanted to complete that circle. And then I knew my own talent. I didn't have the arm like WILLI or my dad did.

I didn't.

I didn't.

I knew I was quick to the baseball, and I owe that to Bill Verdon, one of my outfield coaches. And I knew my ability, and I wanted to stay within my ability.

I knew I was quick to the baseball, and I owe that to Bill Verdon, one of my outfield coaches. And I knew my ability, and I wanted to stay within my ability.

When did you start training.

When did you start training.

When my son was born nineteen eighty nine, When I got in eighty six, I mean, I was the town that was good, but I wasn't you know, I was out clubs, partying like everybody else. You know, like when you're young, it's like, shall sleep when I'm dead?

When my son was born nineteen eighty nine, When I got in eighty six, I mean, I was the town that was good, but I wasn't you know, I was out clubs, partying like everybody else. You know, like when you're young, it's like, shall sleep when I'm dead?

You know what I mean?

You know what I mean?

Shoot?

Shoot?

Who cares?

Who cares?

And all of a sudden, Nikolai, my first wife, was pregnant. I was like, oh, this is real. I have a responsibility. I cold turkey everything, and all I did was go to the gym from that day on, and in nineteen eighty nine was I was leading off with Pittsburgh at that time, and Jim Leland, my manager, who's the most unbelievable manager I ever had my entire life.

And all of a sudden, Nikolai, my first wife, was pregnant. I was like, oh, this is real. I have a responsibility. I cold turkey everything, and all I did was go to the gym from that day on, and in nineteen eighty nine was I was leading off with Pittsburgh at that time, and Jim Leland, my manager, who's the most unbelievable manager I ever had my entire life.

And don't get me wrong.

And don't get me wrong.

Dussy Baker and Felippe Alu are up there, don't get me wrong. But he was my first right and so Pittsburgh was the best for me at that time. So I was leading off and I ain't never been lead off hitter. I'm like, I'm not leading off. I'm leading the team in home runs. But yeah, I got like forty RBIs or something like.

Dussy Baker and Felippe Alu are up there, don't get me wrong. But he was my first right and so Pittsburgh was the best for me at that time. So I was leading off and I ain't never been lead off hitter. I'm like, I'm not leading off. I'm leading the team in home runs. But yeah, I got like forty RBIs or something like.

That's not me.

That's not me.

That's never been my role. So my son was and all I did was trained in the snow in Pittsburgh. I ran every day and then I said, I'm not hitting leading off anymore. And before when I went into locker room to talk to Leland, the only thing he says, since I already know what you're in here, and don't you say a damn word to me. You're my number five hitter, sink or swim kid. Because he knew they wanted to trade me, but he believed in me. I said, Coach, I'm going to spend my whole life and that's the I want m v P. And then after that I started training with Roder Craig Jerry Rice, and all I just started. I just went off the deep end and and then I wanted to be better training wise, and all I did was trading. And I've been doing that for the rest of my life.

That's never been my role. So my son was and all I did was trained in the snow in Pittsburgh. I ran every day and then I said, I'm not hitting leading off anymore. And before when I went into locker room to talk to Leland, the only thing he says, since I already know what you're in here, and don't you say a damn word to me. You're my number five hitter, sink or swim kid. Because he knew they wanted to trade me, but he believed in me. I said, Coach, I'm going to spend my whole life and that's the I want m v P. And then after that I started training with Roder Craig Jerry Rice, and all I just started. I just went off the deep end and and then I wanted to be better training wise, and all I did was trading. And I've been doing that for the rest of my life.

Speak to that training because I mean, Jerry Rice is known synonymously for his off season. He'll runs and train. So you jumped on that boat and all that. That's hard.

Speak to that training because I mean, Jerry Rice is known synonymously for his off season. He'll runs and train. So you jumped on that boat and all that. That's hard.

I mean where we I'd run in the mornings, lift in the morning after running, and then go hit after that. I mean it was from like eight in the morning till in the afternoon, and it's every day except the weekends.

I mean where we I'd run in the mornings, lift in the morning after running, and then go hit after that. I mean it was from like eight in the morning till in the afternoon, and it's every day except the weekends.

Every day.

Every day.

Baseball is known for a lot of unwritten rules. When you first came in the game in eighty six were some of the unwritten rules.

Baseball is known for a lot of unwritten rules. When you first came in the game in eighty six were some of the unwritten rules.

Depends what on written rules you're talking about.

Depends what on written rules you're talking about.

What you can talk about.

What you can talk about.

I can talk about anything you want. This is twenty twenty five. People say whatever they want now days. You know, back when I was there, people didn't say would do it they want? Now to day you say whatever you want. You get kudos for it. Now you get followers, I guess, and social media.

I can talk about anything you want. This is twenty twenty five. People say whatever they want now days. You know, back when I was there, people didn't say would do it they want? Now to day you say whatever you want. You get kudos for it. Now you get followers, I guess, and social media.

You just say.

You just say.

All you gotta do is say as everybody wants to see it now, you know, so, I mean, but.

All you gotta do is say as everybody wants to see it now, you know, so, I mean, but.

What I wish the game was still today is there was a respect level at that time, a veteran level where you earned your stripes, you worked for it, and when you were rookie coming up, you had to go through initiations.

What I wish the game was still today is there was a respect level at that time, a veteran level where you earned your stripes, you worked for it, and when you were rookie coming up, you had to go through initiations.

Yeah, you paid your dues.

Yeah, you paid your dues.

Damn sure back in those days where you know, I didn't have a locker when I first came in. You know, Li Mazilli had Li Mozil. He was my locker mate, which and he was the coolest cat ever too.

Damn sure back in those days where you know, I didn't have a locker when I first came in. You know, Li Mazilli had Li Mozil. He was my locker mate, which and he was the coolest cat ever too.

But he would sit his locker in.

But he would sit his locker in.

My locker right here, and he put his ashtray right in front in the.

My locker right here, and he put his ashtray right in front in the.

Middle of my locker. And he smoked.

Middle of my locker. And he smoked.

My locker was on the floor with on little hangars, you know, a little roll out things, and you sit on the floor and you have to earn your locker, so you have to get a hit. You got to steal a base or score run or hit a home round something before you can get in that locker. So when I first came in, they had my uniform sitting down and I already knew the remooks. My father's there and you know, and leaves like, how you doing, kid, I'm good, fair, And you respected the veterans, and you sat in the front of the bus like all rookies had to sit in front of the bus, all three of.

My locker was on the floor with on little hangars, you know, a little roll out things, and you sit on the floor and you have to earn your locker, so you have to get a hit. You got to steal a base or score run or hit a home round something before you can get in that locker. So when I first came in, they had my uniform sitting down and I already knew the remooks. My father's there and you know, and leaves like, how you doing, kid, I'm good, fair, And you respected the veterans, and you sat in the front of the bus like all rookies had to sit in front of the bus, all three of.

Us, you know. And then we didn't have charter fights.

Us, you know. And then we didn't have charter fights.

We took commercial fights where you had to sit on the plane with other people at the same time.

We took commercial fights where you had to sit on the plane with other people at the same time.

We didn't have that in Pittsburgh.

We didn't have that in Pittsburgh.

When I first came out, and then you had to go down to the they sent me down the baggage claim, and I didn't even know the stuff. Go to the baggage claim. They said, bing, you got to go to the baggage claim and get all the stuff. But I'm sitting in bags claim like this, and nobody's there and I'm going, this is crazy.

When I first came out, and then you had to go down to the they sent me down the baggage claim, and I didn't even know the stuff. Go to the baggage claim. They said, bing, you got to go to the baggage claim and get all the stuff. But I'm sitting in bags claim like this, and nobody's there and I'm going, this is crazy.

And then somebody comes and the bus already left. You know what, everybody knows that it's kind of stuff.

And then somebody comes and the bus already left. You know what, everybody knows that it's kind of stuff.

And then you know, they got and then you had to then, you know, you had to go wait for everybody's luggage and we had to walk up with the bellman to all the veterans rooms and give them their luggage.

And then you know, they got and then you had to then, you know, you had to go wait for everybody's luggage and we had to walk up with the bellman to all the veterans rooms and give them their luggage.

To like four in the morning. We had a lot of things.

To like four in the morning. We had a lot of things.

You had to do as a as a young player, but you appreciate it and you earned your stripes to where when your time came, it was there. There your time to be able to take that initiative and stuff, and you know, the veterans tell you shut up, you shut up, you know, And that was just the way it was.

You had to do as a as a young player, but you appreciate it and you earned your stripes to where when your time came, it was there. There your time to be able to take that initiative and stuff, and you know, the veterans tell you shut up, you shut up, you know, And that was just the way it was.

And it was fun. I mean, not a good time.

And it was fun. I mean, not a good time.

It's like that in basketball now to it ain't no veteran present.

It's like that in basketball now to it ain't no veteran present.

There's zero.

There's zero.

Man, these kids are like bruh. I'm like, I have never gone over to my godfather Willie or Hank Aaron and said bruh, are hey, Hank. I was like, mister Aaron, how you do I mean, there was a different appreciation for what that person did in your career. You know, it's just different nowadays. They walk by you like you exist, you don't even know anything, but just I mean, it's fine, it's their game. Doesn't bother me none.

Man, these kids are like bruh. I'm like, I have never gone over to my godfather Willie or Hank Aaron and said bruh, are hey, Hank. I was like, mister Aaron, how you do I mean, there was a different appreciation for what that person did in your career. You know, it's just different nowadays. They walk by you like you exist, you don't even know anything, but just I mean, it's fine, it's their game. Doesn't bother me none.

You know.

You know.

Sometimes you got to hit rock bottom to come over here.

Sometimes you got to hit rock bottom to come over here.

Yeah, right, because God's gonna bring you wherever you need to get right right. Sometimes they'll walk by me and stuff this and then be like, hey, Barry, what do you see And I'll be like, oh, you must be two for thirty, you know. I go like this, I'm like, you must be two for thirty. You need a little you need Lord in your hand, You need some church right now right. And then when they get it, then you don't hear from them again, and then you go back. But it's just part of the process and it's all good. I mean, like I say, I'm only there for this information if you need it, and that's all I'm there for. I know, anything else is your path. And I always tell them, you've done this before you even met me. And the athletes have to understand, I don't care what sports you're in, you did this before you ever met me. You may have known about me, but you never met me. You have to understand how good you already are. Just to be here, right, There's always gonna be somebody a little bit better than you, even no matter what team you're on, even when you're in high school litle league, there's always somebody better, or you were the best either or it's gonna full circle itself. But you just gotta understand your talent and then get the best of your telling you, you know, I used to. It's like a lot of players when I was coaching with the marrow and stuff, They're like, well, I'm not youre. I'm like, well, that's the first thing you got right, because that's you, ain't me. But let's be the best version of yourself, you know right, Let's be the best vers yourself. I'm only here to help you. I'm not trying to challenge you. I can't do that anymore. I'm too old for that. So take this information and if it works, we're just gonna throw darts at a wall all day and we're gonna do this and something's gonna stick, and let's just keep throwing these darts and whatever. You don't like what I say, thrown in garbage, I don't care. It's your journey. It's not my journey, right, I'm just here to help you get to that journey you're choosing. And if I can, I can. If I can't, kick me to the curb and go somewhere else.

Yeah, right, because God's gonna bring you wherever you need to get right right. Sometimes they'll walk by me and stuff this and then be like, hey, Barry, what do you see And I'll be like, oh, you must be two for thirty, you know. I go like this, I'm like, you must be two for thirty. You need a little you need Lord in your hand, You need some church right now right. And then when they get it, then you don't hear from them again, and then you go back. But it's just part of the process and it's all good. I mean, like I say, I'm only there for this information if you need it, and that's all I'm there for. I know, anything else is your path. And I always tell them, you've done this before you even met me. And the athletes have to understand, I don't care what sports you're in, you did this before you ever met me. You may have known about me, but you never met me. You have to understand how good you already are. Just to be here, right, There's always gonna be somebody a little bit better than you, even no matter what team you're on, even when you're in high school litle league, there's always somebody better, or you were the best either or it's gonna full circle itself. But you just gotta understand your talent and then get the best of your telling you, you know, I used to. It's like a lot of players when I was coaching with the marrow and stuff, They're like, well, I'm not youre. I'm like, well, that's the first thing you got right, because that's you, ain't me. But let's be the best version of yourself, you know right, Let's be the best vers yourself. I'm only here to help you. I'm not trying to challenge you. I can't do that anymore. I'm too old for that. So take this information and if it works, we're just gonna throw darts at a wall all day and we're gonna do this and something's gonna stick, and let's just keep throwing these darts and whatever. You don't like what I say, thrown in garbage, I don't care. It's your journey. It's not my journey, right, I'm just here to help you get to that journey you're choosing. And if I can, I can. If I can't, kick me to the curb and go somewhere else.

You don't know what I mean. It's okay. You ain't hurt my feelings. You know what I mean. So that's it. It's all liked.

You don't know what I mean. It's okay. You ain't hurt my feelings. You know what I mean. So that's it. It's all liked.

There's some younger guys that you really enjoyed working with, did you want you know, wouldn't mind sharing that like soaked it up?

There's some younger guys that you really enjoyed working with, did you want you know, wouldn't mind sharing that like soaked it up?

And you know, I love working with all of them.

And you know, I love working with all of them.

I never have a favorite. I have a challenge of each individual. I never have like a favorite because I could do so many things out there. I'd love the challenge of getting you right or fixing a puzzle, because that's what I did in my head all the time. In my own personal career, we were always, you know, you're always having to revamp yourself right, and it's taken on the challenge of I don't care if it's weighed. I don't give a credit if it's Mookie Betts, I don't care who it is that I've talked to or worked with, or Dexter Fowler back in the days and stuff like that. It doesn't matter Alex Rodrigue I worked with. It's that puzzle that I enjoy. It's not a favorite. Alex was easier because he's already the lead of the league.

I never have a favorite. I have a challenge of each individual. I never have like a favorite because I could do so many things out there. I'd love the challenge of getting you right or fixing a puzzle, because that's what I did in my head all the time. In my own personal career, we were always, you know, you're always having to revamp yourself right, and it's taken on the challenge of I don't care if it's weighed. I don't give a credit if it's Mookie Betts, I don't care who it is that I've talked to or worked with, or Dexter Fowler back in the days and stuff like that. It doesn't matter Alex Rodrigue I worked with. It's that puzzle that I enjoy. It's not a favorite. Alex was easier because he's already the lead of the league.

Right, we don't.

Right, we don't.

Our conversations are different. And understanding that each conversation I have with each person is different. You can't this one method is.

Our conversations are different. And understanding that each conversation I have with each person is different. You can't this one method is.

Not going to work with this guy. He doesn't.

Not going to work with this guy. He doesn't.

I can sit there and say, you know, you need to hit off your front leg a little bit because you're too backsided. Well, may not work with this other guy. He doesn't understand that. He's like, he's leaning so far forward. I'm like, no, man, he like this, you know what I mean? I have to tailor tailor it to what works for them, right, And it's just creating the mind it's changing the mindset. What does a man hate to do? If you're really good at something, it's telling him they can't do something. They gonna show you they can do it. Right, What did I just It's just a mind shift, right, it's a mind shift because he already has a talent to do it. And saying, well, you're gonna tell me that you're a professional athlete. You just can't hit the ball right there? Who you talking to? Well, then you know what. I mechanically didn't do anything for you. You already fixed it your damn you don't really need me, you know what I mean. So sometimes it's just redirecting the mind for great athletes, and all of them are great. If you're in a if you're in a professional sport, you're great, no question, because there's so little of you there. Come on, brother, remember you are good.

I can sit there and say, you know, you need to hit off your front leg a little bit because you're too backsided. Well, may not work with this other guy. He doesn't understand that. He's like, he's leaning so far forward. I'm like, no, man, he like this, you know what I mean? I have to tailor tailor it to what works for them, right, And it's just creating the mind it's changing the mindset. What does a man hate to do? If you're really good at something, it's telling him they can't do something. They gonna show you they can do it. Right, What did I just It's just a mind shift, right, it's a mind shift because he already has a talent to do it. And saying, well, you're gonna tell me that you're a professional athlete. You just can't hit the ball right there? Who you talking to? Well, then you know what. I mechanically didn't do anything for you. You already fixed it your damn you don't really need me, you know what I mean. So sometimes it's just redirecting the mind for great athletes, and all of them are great. If you're in a if you're in a professional sport, you're great, no question, because there's so little of you there. Come on, brother, remember you are good.

You gotta work with.

You gotta work with.

That ten a hundred mile fastballs pissed to you today you're hitting any of.

That ten a hundred mile fastballs pissed to you today you're hitting any of.

Them out one hundred.

Them out one hundred.

That's easy right now today, I.

That's easy right now today, I.

Don't care how hard you throw a baseball.

Don't care how hard you throw a baseball.

They gone.

They gone.

There ain't no way you can throw a baseball sixt So I can't just do like this. If there's a catcher behind home plate that sits like this, what a glove and you throw a hundred mind, don't you just go like this?

There ain't no way you can throw a baseball sixt So I can't just do like this. If there's a catcher behind home plate that sits like this, what a glove and you throw a hundred mind, don't you just go like this?

Boom boom. All I did was change this object to a bat. I ain't gott to change nothing. I just change the object. Now, if you're asking.

Boom boom. All I did was change this object to a bat. I ain't gott to change nothing. I just change the object. Now, if you're asking.

Me to do something spectacler, that would take time for my body to get.

Me to do something spectacler, that would take time for my body to get.

Used to it.

Used to it.

At sixty but just going up there, but to go up there and hit it. And I don't care how hard you think. As long as I can see it, I hit it.

At sixty but just going up there, but to go up there and hit it. And I don't care how hard you think. As long as I can see it, I hit it.

That's crazy, great though, don't.

That's crazy, great though, don't.

Willie could do it back, you know, and even when is it sixties? Him and my dad and them would come and hit all the time. They were did all the time.

Willie could do it back, you know, and even when is it sixties? Him and my dad and them would come and hit all the time. They were did all the time.

There's a rich history of racism in baseball. When you first got into the game, did you feel it, see it? Did you hear a story from your dad or Willie or Hank or anything like that.

There's a rich history of racism in baseball. When you first got into the game, did you feel it, see it? Did you hear a story from your dad or Willie or Hank or anything like that.

The problem with that question is that it's it's a fuel for the media to run with he said questions, right, he said? He said, He said, we already know that answer. We don't need to you know, I kind of stay out of it only because if you want the truth, it's an industry that needs to come together to make it happen. And the industry starts up here. Okay, I'm down on the bottom floor, so we as an industry, we hear bottom and top have to find a way to come together to balance it. Right for me to sit there and say is there racism?

The problem with that question is that it's it's a fuel for the media to run with he said questions, right, he said? He said, He said, we already know that answer. We don't need to you know, I kind of stay out of it only because if you want the truth, it's an industry that needs to come together to make it happen. And the industry starts up here. Okay, I'm down on the bottom floor, so we as an industry, we hear bottom and top have to find a way to come together to balance it. Right for me to sit there and say is there racism?

Yeah, I mean I could say yes, that's true. We all know that.

Yeah, I mean I could say yes, that's true. We all know that.

I mean, as black people, we know what's going on. We're not blinded by any of that. Right, We're not a threat to anyone. We're not trying to pose a threat to anyone. We're trying to be relevant or equal or valued.

I mean, as black people, we know what's going on. We're not blinded by any of that. Right, We're not a threat to anyone. We're not trying to pose a threat to anyone. We're trying to be relevant or equal or valued.

Right.

Right.

Well, the industry has to come together, and how do we do that? People need to sit at the table and figure it out.

Well, the industry has to come together, and how do we do that? People need to sit at the table and figure it out.

That's simple. That's a conversation. You have to decline in black payers in baseball. Is it because of the love and black kids not loving baseball? Or is it because other races are just dominating the game of basketball.

That's simple. That's a conversation. You have to decline in black payers in baseball. Is it because of the love and black kids not loving baseball? Or is it because other races are just dominating the game of basketball.

The other racer.

The other racer.

If we're going to be technical, white races always dominated baseball. I mean it was there since they won until Jackie Robinson broke the color bearer. If you want to be honest and true about it, how many star blacks are in baseball?

If we're going to be technical, white races always dominated baseball. I mean it was there since they won until Jackie Robinson broke the color bearer. If you want to be honest and true about it, how many star blacks are in baseball?

You got to start Latinos.

You got to start Latinos.

That's what I'm start Asians.

That's what I'm start Asians.

Yeah, you got star whites right.

Yeah, you got star whites right.

When I played baseball, you had me King Griffyth Junior, Eric Davis, Ozzie Smith McGee.

When I played baseball, you had me King Griffyth Junior, Eric Davis, Ozzie Smith McGee.

I can go on and on and on and on.

I can go on and on and on and on.

Andre Dawson, I mean I can name a ton of inspiring black athletes on the field to inspire other black kids to want to play right right? So what is that an industrial problem? The industry needs to fix it.

Andre Dawson, I mean I can name a ton of inspiring black athletes on the field to inspire other black kids to want to play right right? So what is that an industrial problem? The industry needs to fix it.

I went to school with a lot of white kids in high school and travel baseball was expensive. It was almost priced out of my community. Although I went to school with kids that can afford it. I feel like it's kind of priced out of the black community at times, and I think that kind of hinders the opportunity for some of these kids to come up and really have an opportunity at it.

I went to school with a lot of white kids in high school and travel baseball was expensive. It was almost priced out of my community. Although I went to school with kids that can afford it. I feel like it's kind of priced out of the black community at times, and I think that kind of hinders the opportunity for some of these kids to come up and really have an opportunity at it.

It is very expensive. I mean, that's what five hundred dollars. It's like crazy.

It is very expensive. I mean, that's what five hundred dollars. It's like crazy.