M hmm. Everything she does off it's because she never loses sign of what's important. Put you on a military transport tonight. Yes, was backing down on either side. We have a bona fide crisis. We'll follow it up together. Get to the truth. I did what hawd to be done. Honey alone, A slow welcome back all the smoke, my brother Jack. We got a special guest here are brother, although you don't look like us, a lot ugly out here and say, man, we appreciate you. You won here in the Yola establishments that keep for having us, Thanks for coming back. We're gonna jump right into it. Man, Um, highly touted high school player and uh, you decided to take the jump straight to the league. How come he didn't want to go to college first? Bro Um, I don't know it during that time, where don't I don't know what the hell I was doing? Man, be honest, you know I didn't started playing basketball times a freshman in high school. You know what I'm saying. And you know, growing up I didn't really have hoop dreams. It wasn't like, you know, I wanted to play in the NFL. You know, my goal was to play for, not the name and play for the New York Giants. But when I got to when I got to high school, I was six four, sorry, and when I got to this new school, everybody just thought out hooped. So they put me on the team as a freshman. So on the freshman team, my nickname was Big Daddy, and uh big Daddy. A couple of people still call you that. That's not true, said, that's not true. But yeah, they called me big Daddy, and Big Daddy was not good, you know what I'm saying. I barely played uh My soult that summer. Um, I met this dude named j Syriac and he was trying to get the best player on my team during that time, Dona Kurt Hobson, And he was like, yo, you can. You can hook me up with Kurt, and if you bring Kurt, we'll let you play on the team or whatever. Yeah, plus one, try to get Kurt. I didn't get Kurt. But at the end of the day, dude took a liking to me, started, you know, helping me work out, and introduced me to the coach of the road runners would do names Sandy Pioning and Sammy started working with me and that's how that stack. We get to that at some point. But stack, I mean, excuse me, Sandy like told me everything, Bro. He told me how to you know, chew gum and dribble a basketball, chew um and pick the ball up and lay it up. It was like a really like step by step process and end up transferent schools the St. Patrick, which is a national powerhouse high school. Sophomore year, I played a little bit. I played, I started, wasn't that good. I played with the All American Nation he Holloway and he stole your m V. But playing with Shower was a lot of pressure, man, because you know, obviously all American, he wants to win the state championship. I'm gonna start and powerful and I can't catch. So just imagine point guard that pass and I can't catch, Bro. So he used to cuss me out every game. So it got to the point, Bro, within the games, if it was a play and I was gonna be open, I run behind my man, so I couldn't. So I have to hear that's crazy about So that's me as a soft But you said you want to play football. I wanted to play football. I was on the line if I was offensive, yeah, and I was a defensive and Mac Farland you know already. So I just run into people and just you know, just run into people. Hide behind the dude so he couldn't pass you the ball. I'm telling you, man, as my man rotated, I rotated with him just so I don't have to work just throwing me the ball and then cussing me out. So that was my sophomore year. But you know that summer, you know, obviously I took you know, my game started six span. I got invited to the Adida's ABC D camp and you know, I got out there as a you know, rising junior and nobody knew me, and I bawled out. I made the All Star game and then that's when you know, I got on the map for the most part. And then that next year, I played against lamar Odom down in South Jersey and that's when I got my name. So you know, obviously l O was the dude and I got the best of them that night. I busted that. The numbers were something like, you know whatever, we're gonna talk about this when you come on the show. And we won that game, bro, But I'm saying I tell you all the time, like I got mine that I got my Owlharrington name off of that game versus Ow and so big shout out to lamar Ow and for hold of me now to give that opportunity. But after that, you know, things just started to take off. I started working my way up to up to board and you know, by the time I was a senior, I went to night Ye All American camp that's where all the top players was at. Even though my AU team was Adidas, went there just hunting boys down, you know what I'm saying. And I ended up being the MVP of the camp. And you know that that point, I was the number one player. And just because you know, I've seen all these other the other the number one players in the country was going pro out of high school, I was like, do the same thing, you know what I'm saying. And my mom was totally against it. She was just like, you're too young, you too immature. What you're gonna do up there with grown men? Shout out mama. Yeah. So it took me, like it literally took me like a month to convince her because at that time, you know, your parents had to sign off on paperwork for you're going to the draft. Have to beg my mother so she don't have to work no more, you know what I'm saying. But she finally signed the paperwork, and you know, the rest is history. But if I went to school, I probably was gonna go to Georgia Tech. I wanted to go down to Atlanta. That's when my grandmother was. You know, I had a lot of family down there, so I want to go play in front of the family if I did go to college. So now you're drafted to the Indiana Pacers where Winnie franchise, Reggie Miller's there. There's a lot of talent there. Tell me what that's likeing and how do you find your footing at a seventeen eighteen year old? Eighteen year old? So you know it was are going in there with all those vets, right, because I mean I was playing with real vets. I played with the Davis Boys. I played with Chris Mullen, Sam Perkins, uh, Derrek McKee, Hayward Workman, Like, those are those are my vets? You know what I'm saying. So these dudes was like grown kids, families, the whole thing. So a lot don't never really have time to hang out with me. But uh, during that time coming up in the league, Like you know, rookies used to used to be hard on rookies, you know what I'm saying. So I used to have to you know, obviously have doughnuts every day, fresh hot doughnuts from Crispy Crean. Did you eat any of them before you game? Ain't gonna lie, bro. So I got out of control in the beginning, like a gained like ten pounds, bro. And I know Donnie Walls came in there was like, what's going on. It's like, I don't know, Donut. He's like, are you eating doughnuts? But don'tut run Like, yes, I'm smashing the donuts. I give them the nice and hot and tasty. So I was smashing the doughnuts, but you no doughnuts, orange juice, having to get their cars clean, unloading the plane, unloading the bus. You can only practice, kid. I was the only rookie wookie year, so like they used to run me thing, you know what I'm saying. But you know, during that time, that's when I realized that successful players in the league actually smoke weed because I was the rookie. Because you know, I used to get sent to go buy blunts and all that type of stuff, you know what I'm saying. But uh, you know, I was blessed to have those guys. You know what I'm saying. I really feel like because those guys was around, it allowed me to play sixteen years, you know what I'm saying, because they helped me, you know, set a foundation of what it took to be a propro first and how to survive in the league. Sixteen years. All that was was you know, being professional, not being late, you know what I'm saying, working your ass off, and if you do those things, and with the talent that I had, you know what I'm saying, I was set up and have longevity in the league. So, you know, as much as I wish, I came to a team where you know, in my rookie year I got major minutes and all that My thing was a blessing in disguise that I was able to sit down for a year and kind of just watched and figure it out for myself, like you know what it took to actually be in the league and you know, be able to you know, like I said, you had had that longevity, would it take the crack once you started playing, like when someone got hurt, it was just that's something you killed that What was it that got you played the next year? Well, what happened was Um Mulley left, right, Um, and Dale Davis left, So that was the three and the four right obviously, see Antonio left, So Antonio was the backup four and Mulley was the backup three UM behind Jalen. And so that gave me an opportunity that summer. You know, I worked my ass off. I got an unbelievable shape. You know, I lived in the gym. I was just waiting for my opportunity. And during that summer when I lived in New York, so I was playing against guys like Anthony Mason, God blessed dead. Uh, you know, Malik silly. You know, I was able to play against guys that play all the time in the league and kind of you know, learned from them as well some of the nuances of the game. So when I came back in you know, my second year, you know, I was ready to play, you know what I'm saying. And for the most part, I played, you know, most of that year until I actually hurt my back. You skipped over the side. How did you and out? You and Jack me from the Oh? Yes, so the guy Sandy Pan and I'm talking about that, Uh tolt me the game or whatever. He has his gym in and Junior New Jersey And to this day, I still don't know how Jack ended up being in there. But Jack walked in, uh with jeans on, you know, the workout or whatever, came in, you know, took all this stuff off, you know, put his workout ship on. And what was amazing. I turned out, looked and his jeans were still standing there. Like literally the jeans was still was started up. Stay flow, babe, we had that stay flow. He had so much starts in his jeans. Dog he took him off. You just set him up. He just stood him. That kind of dude to like that just standard. So I was amazed by that. I'm like, yo, bro, how your pitts still standing me? He's like some slow flow or whatever. He said. I was like, oh, I ain't never heard of that before. Where you from? So you know what I'm saying, We worked out or whatever. And you know, obviously you know he was two years older than me, you know what I'm saying. So obviously he had game, you know what I'm saying, and uh, that was the only day he came, you know what I'm saying. So I did your thing and kept it moving. It was just a workout, you know how we do it. We work out with Sandy. He got him to workout in and never seen him again until I got to the league. That's when I first met my brother, you know what I'm saying. And obviously we hit it off. And then you know, obviously when he got into the league, he played New Jersey and you know, Steph was like my big homie, my big brother, and the same thing to him. So that's how we started to reconnect. And you know, obviously the rest of system. So you guys are traded for each other somewhat and oh four, and then you eventually end up back on the pacers together. You guys want to talk about that? What was that? Like? Well, the playing together was short, real short. In Indiana, he got us ran out of town. Actually, what happened we can talk about it really is your fault. I was at home chilling, Jack. Let's go with the rest of the team is out, Let's go. I'm like, no, we've been out all day. Jack. Come on, man, so you're the reason why I left the house. That may be true, but what happened was transpired after he left the house, man, So whatever, it was, man like, so we get traded for each other. I should have never left. This guy's unbelievable. I leave, he goes and have a brawl in Detroit. You know what I'm saying. He starts with that, So I'm like that I would have been in that, thank god, because I needed all my chicken right, shout out, thank god I wasn't there. But okay, so from a distance, I look, I see that, but you know, Stack go on the stands, he's fighting everybody in the ring or whatever. I like, yeah, this guy's wild. This guy's wild ship. They have some success or whatever. So obviously now there's an opportunity for me to actually go back to the team. So I'm like, you know what those I felt like. You know, I should have never left Indiana in the first place, to be honest, because Atlanta was a hell hole. You know what I'm saying. I went from winning sixty one games and to the two thousand three fourth season to four or five season winning thirteen games. So like the numbers was crazy though, my numbers was crazy. But they don't respect numbers when you were thirteen. They're like, somebody got to school. No problems when you get big numbers on their win team. It was so bad in Atlanta, Broveen one time. We want to lose the street for so long that by the time we won, Sports Center ran a special of like all the things that happened since the last time we won the game, and it was like the Grammys, the super Bowl, March madness. It was like it was like all kind of stuff. The playoffs. I go, didn't even tell me how that was. We just passed, passed telling me how bad it was gonna be in Atlanta or whatever. So to his point, you know, um, I get back to the team and you know, obviously you know they had a lot of success, and I'm thinking obviously adding me and all this type of stuff. Now I'm understanding, and I'm understanding now, like you know, I'm gonna come off the bench and I'm okay with it now, you know what I'm saying. I got through that process this year six for you seven. It was years six when I left. When I came back, you will start remember run. I just left, so you were starting, Yeah, you will start, that's right. I was left and that's why they brant you back because they had to get wrong up out of it. That's right. So you know we're playing well you know what I'm not. We're playing okay or whatever. But we get through training camp. So you know the night, you know that changed everything for me. So when I get back, you know, I'm thinking, like I'm set, like I'm never leaving Indiana and they love me whatever. So I go and buy a house. The house said I want to gut into all this stuff to it, so I got it. I put all kind of wild stuff, swede walls to TVs in every room. This went crazy, right because I'm thinking I'm backing in the end of this state or whatever. So training camp, we get a day off, bad start days off and no good get a day off, right, We have no practice the next day, so everybody like, yo, let's go out and hang out. So I should have known the night was gonna be crazy because is I come out of this restaurant called Champs and Jamal Tinsley is driving by, so I wave them down. So I'm like, mom, Mama, So you pull over. So I'm like, what you're about to do? So as I stick my head in the car. In the back seat of his car, he has like twenty five guns, right, souse. So we had all just got our gun license the sheriff that came to my house and gave us all gun license like two weeks before that. Go ahead, I finished. So I should have known this is gonna be a wild night because I looked in the car and he got He's in a six forty five BMW so it's no real back seat, but it's filled with guns. So I'm like, where are you coming from from? So he's like, we're all coming from the gun range and we all got our licenses, blah blah blah blah blah. I'm like all right, I'm like, yo, let's do something tonight. They're like, all right, let's go. I think it's called Pure Passion or what was the name of the spot, Rio Rio Rio cl Rio, Let's go to Rio. Let's go to Rio. So I'm like, all right, let's go to Rio. Get on the phone, course and first person I'm gonna call just like what you're doing. And I'm at the house. I'm chilling. Hey, let's go to real to night when got practice them all, let's go, let's go shake it up a little bit, all right, so we all meet that real. So I think the nice team, the whole team. We all in there, you know, throwing some dollars around, having a great time, you know, get around that time. For me, I'm like, I'm gone, so shake his hand. They just act like I'm right behind you. What else? I'm like, all right, cool, So I leave, I go downtown. I'm staying at the hotel downtown. I get up the next morning and that's when I had this bullshit as mohawk. It was terrible. What was I thinking? And that's why I'm just saying, like for them to be my homeboys. And nobody pulled me aside and was like, son was super weak and your ship was balded right here too, was thin here. And that's why that's why I struggled with it. I had to get it cut all the time because it was some bullshit. But nobody, not one of my homeboys, said, yo, family, cut that off. What it definitely you would have been saying jokes and have definitely maybe cut my shoot off. Take it out. So I get up in the morning. Whatever. Sunny day is a nice day, beautiful day, off off day. So I'm going to the barbershop to go get my mohawk touched up. So I get in there and when I sit down to dude, like, you know everybody I from last night, and I'm like, what you mean. He's like, no, the pacers there are. Y'all had to shootout last night. I said, a shootout. What you're talking about, bro? He's like, yeah, man, y'all with your team would had a shootout with some dudes at the club. I'm like, what club? You're like real. So I'm literally the last person in the state of indienda the note that these boys had to shoot right just so I called stack He don't answer, obviously. I called jo Jo that we at the hospital. So I'm like we're about to leave though, so I'm like all right, cool, So like everybody's gonna meet the Stackhouse in like a couple of hours. So I go to Stackhouse and uh, you know, it's like all somber, you know whatever, But I come with Danny Grange. So we walk in and that comes turned the corner and his face is like this big crazy and Danny Grangel looking at him and sit, dude, hey, it made me laugh. I couldn't really laugh at my lips are so slow. Lips couldn't meet. Oh my god. So so to go back. When I was pulling, I pulled out the parking lot. I was right behind him. But as I was turning the corn the light, I've seen Jamal running out the club and it was chasing Jamal to his car. So I put my ship in reverse, and as I you know, we just got a gun license. So I pulled my ship out and I ran over there with Jamal. I had my ship in my hand. By time I get over there, you know, like we're about to fight. So I hit one of them my pills to bout we get the fighting. More dudes come up out the club. I've been in that position too many times, I know. For I still get surrounded and stumped out, I'm gonna let off some warning shots. I let two off. By that time I was running to my car. Somebody, one of the niggers that got in the car and sized me up in the parking lot and hit me going like thirty five party with power boom, knock him in the air. I hit the ground the momentum of the car hit me in my face is hitting the ground. I stand up, all my teeth gone, my lips shattered, but and I was kind of I was out of it, but maybe come back was one of my teammates. I ain't gotta sat a name on here. He started letting off at the car and that made me come out of it. So as I stood up and saw that, I pulled my ship out and chased the car down. As I shot my last shot, I passed out. Wake up in the back of the car with Markets and the police. Markets daance the police car because just for some the fact that they had all of us arrested. But they had me in the car and I was unconscious, so I hit him kicking the door. He think I'm dying because I lifts my teeth going, my lips just bleed everywhere. He think I'm dying, so he kicking the door and that's how I wake up. Timm Is. Later they let us go. We meet at the gas station, and that's I think that's when we talked to Jail for the first time. Because we all met at the gas station. We all had guns. We always tend to go tasting shut up. I was ready to kill everything moving and mid mid sentence, jamaineo Nil stopped me. Say Jack, I feel all that ship. I feel all that ship you talked about. I want to kill somebody too. But you got to go to the hospital. Dog, you got to go to the hospital. And I'm not even thinking that. But what the funked up part was? As soon as he said it, I ship instantly started heard gone, started hurting everything. Man. I had to love all your teethop and my top was out. I had to get a plastic surge on my lips for two hours with no anesthesia. So they're putting cutting my lips, taking rocks and ship out about on my lips and ship for two hours. I'm holding a rid call out of hand and uh, I got who was with my girl hand at the time, and just I parted for two hours after that shout, I slept like seven hours straight. So that's how. So that was my That's how when I came back to the Indian and while I got out of it, that's why we got traded. So now from there is where we all get connected, yes and go to state. So you guys get traded in late January, to go to State. It was like January. I was on my way after league. Got a bounced for other the league three four years, never really got a chance to play Bear. They're calling me up that pre summer. Yo, we're whooping it. Uh, we're whooping uh. Down in the city. I drove an hour and a half from Sack. Played well. Nellie was watching long story. I get on the team. So we're having a not a very good year, but I'm starting to play consistently and played good enough to where they're ready to get rid of Mike Dunlevy and Troy Murphy because I'm playing well. And we hear buzz Who's coming, Who's coming this, Who's coming that? Mike dunne what he wanted FUNDI dudes that want the best team. Troy's cooler ship too, Mike Donald Milwaukee. So then uh so I remember the day the trade went down, they told us who was coming, and we're like, wow, funk we get there. But we only had like seven dudes that day. Maybe I want to say we played the Lakers, the Clippers, we were in l A, got beat. But then y'all came and just became an instant brotherhood, like you guys had the connection already. I didn't know, really, I just knew you guys from playing me and BT had you had to nextion to b D. But it was just like instant. So tell me what it was like from Indiana to where you think a dream situation is and then Jack gets you traded? Uh? What was that? Like? That's fun? Up man under saying like it sucked because I had Like I said, you know, I didn't finish my point with the house, Like I spent all this money in this house and Bro, I literally slepting it three nights, Man, your house three nights. But that's how fast it happened. It happened that fast. I gutted it, bro. So I lived in a hotel for three months. Bro. But whatever, but you know obviously coming there bro So. The thing, the one thing I can't say about um Indiana and I think what I think what we bought to that team was the brotherhood kind of vibe. You know what I'm saying, because that was the same way we we hung out in Indiana. You know what I'm saying. I feel like the reason why we wasn't having the success we sold to have on the court was because we was enjoying nightlife a little too much. You know what I'm saying, Remember because I can remember, you know too, I could recall two trips, one in Toronto and one in l A where like we get to the arena for shooting around and like we bring it in and like it smelt like nothing but like gray Goose and Patron like it's just it's coming out of everybody pours to the point where like Rick like, Yo, look, let's just go back. Y'all gets to rest and come back ready to play the play to night And you know what I'm saying. So, I think we was kind of letting the lightlife kind of get to get the best of us, just because you know, we felt like we were so good we could kind of turn it on. We wanted doing different things like that, but I think we got traded. It kind of woke both of us up, and I think that coming to the Golden State situation, we knew that it was gonna be more of a challenge. The team had been to the playoffs in thirteen years and different things like that, so had gave us a focus and gave us something to you know, to strive for, you know, what I'm saying, and then getting in the locker room and realizing how many real dudes was in the locker room. We was like, oh ship, we fell on our we fell on our be nice you not not me, not knowing you at all, and then realizing you are the craziest motherfucker's I could ever meet. You know what I'm saying, Wow, inappropriate? You just a wild motherfucker. That's just Matt. Then beat who is? I called him the Walt Disney of who because he is just a thousand people in the same day. One conversation, Monte was a young killer, but but didn't know what was going on. He was just waiting us and just teach you but tell him just thing, just sick him on anything. Jay Rich another dude ready to go ahead, and he was coming back from injury, so he had a lot to prove. I think we just came into a perfect situation. And then we bought that family Vibe family dinners, and you know, we connected our wives and our girls and different things like that. And you know, in two months time, bro, I felt like I had been with yall for obviously. What really brought us together was, you know, down the stretch when I we had to win like fourteen games, even think about eighteen out of one, like that's crazy. And we all looked at each other, and I think it was because of those five six weeks beforehand of building that we could look at each other and know, like, you know, we can actually do this ship but enough the court too. Is what people don't understand is like it's crazy that you said, you guys are kind of murdered on both inso Indiana and you thought you could turn We burned it and Golden State too, but we had, like you said, we have more, We didn't have a We didn't have as much cushion, so we had to Okay, we're gonna go out and get fun up. We still got to come out of hoop tomorrow. We did that every single day. And I think what was unique about our team to which I think, um, you know, I think it affects the game now, is like we had a type of team. We can hold each other accountable anything. Anybody can say anything to anybody, whether it hurt your feelings or not. You got over it. You got to be close, you know, to like stories where like one of us is not playing and you come out the game, we could choke on you and not be personal. You know what I'm saying, because if you don't have that level of communication, you know, the seeing, it's like that could be miss for me. Like you know, that was a blessing, you know what I'm saying, being able to play with y'all, and you know that that feeling that we had during that time, I'm not ben't gonna lie like after I moved on from there, I never could recreate that, you know what I'm saying. Nowhere, I don't think none of them, you know what I'm saying. What we what we had was specially bro that we did everything together and then off the court we went. Off the court, we did every People don't realize like you said, you said that was it was. It was a three months span where we went from the bottom of the West to the A seed and we the last night, remember the Clippers had the Clippers lost to someone in that was in Portland. We had beat Portland. Don't needed the Clippers to lose, and the Clippers lost to a team they shouldn't have lost to. And we knew as we were winning that they had lost, that we lost our minds. Well, I remember that because remember that game in Portland, I got kicked out and Don there was a cable to He's like, I don't care about just getting kicked out, just don't get suspended. We're gonna make the playoffs. And he was walking me off the court. I remember the video. I don't care about to get kicked out suspended for the next game. We're gonna make the playoff. But you guys, you guys brought such an amazing energy to our team. You know, I mean, both as skilled as can be from the wing position, from the all over the floor, but down something someone that could do a lot of stuff in a bigger player, because people don't really like that's Nellie ball to y'all. You know what I mean? You're guarding, y'ell. Mean you know what I mean, I'm playing the five, y'all Remember that? Do y'all remember every time we played y'allmber The next day, I couldn't practice it nothing because that was used to we had. I had the front of them in front of someone that's seven four meets and then he's gonna be needing you all in your back. So I never like every time we played them, the next day, I could not remember for the game. He's like, different, I ain't started the day. What you mean that you took yourself out to start? They fun that they started to day. Man, I'm like, I do that on purpose too. I'm like, why can't goose from them? We laughed at you until we had to go at boosted in the bod mil s. Oh my god, you pay. Then the ship was crazy and then like I said that, I was a too much span And then we talked about the trade that happened with Jay Rich and then the beginning of the next season, my mom died, so I'm kind of out the mix. You kind of fall out with Nelly and that was it. We were the team was going. They didn't resign Baron. The following year, we traded Jay Rich first. J Richards gone first. Yeah, then Bed he was the next season Becau. Remember the next season we won forty eight games, make the playoffs. Yeah, yeah, Denver. Then that night Denver one, they beat the Clippers and they got in and we and we lost. And that was the first time I smoked. I smoked weed. Yeah lost. It was after we lost in Utah, right, it was. I mean, I'm saying it was no no. It was the second year after we figured we were in the playoffs no more. That's the first time I smoked, wasn't that was remember smoked? You had the drug test the next day in Phoenix. Diluted it because what happened was y'all told me because the trainer called me on the way to the gym and was like, yo, you gotta piss test. I'm like, get the funk out of here. First ever, first time I ever smoked. Everyone came to my room. Everyone, I got off the bus, everybody was he told me. I got off the bus and I went the Whole Foods and I got that Sony number seven thing y'all told me to get. I got that. I drank it that she was disgusting, and I just started pissing all day, pissing all day. So I got to the game and I'm nervous, so I don't piss. When I get there, I tell him I can't pissa after the game. So remember y'all was waiting on me and everything, and when I pissed, it was just all water. So that's when I realized, you get a dilute test, you get one one. So that was my one. That's how I passed. I had right, it was all water. He put the thing in. He was like, this is all water and I was like, what you want, athlete? What you mean hydrated? Got me that? But yeah, that that was the first. But I remember that night and I was paranoid in that room and called liquid man. Y'all had me, y'all had me. I was high because you smoked, smoked, but you would never smoked, never smoked. But you wasn't really passing it up though. I'm gonna keep it real, like you burned with used to it. But I when I got to my room and got weird, got weird. Ship when I got in that room, bro, and we we always talked about the game six after we won. That night was like all the stuff we don't you remember what you remember from the night, man, So you know I didn't. So if you remember, you know I had my wife with me, so I didn't get a chance to go with you boys. You know what I'm saying. That night, But I remember going to the city, um, that Italian restaurant we go to all the time, and like literally we walked in. Everybody like stood up cheering. You know what I'm saying. We was rock so i' I really I really believe that one of us could have got got away with murder that year. Hot When I tell you when I never see like my biggest world James, I've been in winning markets, but I've been I've seen been a winner. I've never seen it. People the way they carried us and go to the States, sat us down in the city. I think they would have the body knocked somebody off and there was some dudes walking down the street there to help you get rid of it. I believe that they loved us. Bro We had like you talk, you know, like the real authentic culture of Oakland and all that that we had the sun with us. That's why I tell people when I went back to seventeen and got a chance to win the ring, they talked about that we believe team more than the current success they had, And then blew my mind. I'm like, you've got Steph, Katie, You've got these we believe is that's our heart, that's Oakland, that's this, that's that. And then to see the other players like Steph and Katie and them do show love to our team too. Were in the jerseys and the warm ups and all that show. I'm just like, like I said, you know, I still got my career about that. So I go and show my face all in the supermarkets, all look the open lines for me, discount the ship out of my growth like it's crazy out there that night man, and I remember obviously talking to y'all like the next day and hearing some of the stories about smoking with coaches and all that other stuff. So you didn't go with us to Snoop Bow telling it had to be buried with bed and probably would me it had to be And when I talked about what you said when he was like pop Ridle, you heard the story. Yeah, that's it must have been baring now that one me I was with, I was I was the wife. He did the right things. You did what you're supposed to do because it wasn't up in trouble that night you supposed to do had a blast blast. So now you've been out of the NBA for six seven six years season crazy right? It flies, yo, know what I'm saying that, you know I'll be saying I'm out sixteen. So what was it like? You know, you didn't go to Collie so you went from high school to the NBA, made good money. Now you're retired at what how are you? Thirty four? So I had I had knee surgery right um and I think two thousand and twelve or whatever, and got staff infection from the surgery. So um. You know during that time, I thought I was going to die the whole ship. I was sucked up two weeks. I lost like forty pounds, Like I was skinny, like you bro, he was looking like on that one movie. Yeah, so I know how to get skinny. I was gonna get sick of something, you know. I'm all with all the diets and all the other ship eat grass and leaves and now you see anything. That's why I asked them early in the interview with them dons. I know Al used to suck them. I could eat snack man. And he always used to be in the locker room with like three of them waste wraps on, always doing crunches the whole time before anybody we played together. I always was on the wait things. Yeah, he always because news at any second. He was like you were fat Herington, get on the scale. I'm like, you bitch, ask whatever. But yeah, that's why I was always working out over everybody in the restaurant. He's done crunch everywhere. I always have a six pack, but I got a six pack after basketball, and I'll tell you how. But when I um, you know, so I had to start, had the staff infection messed me up. Um. So the next season, I pretty I went to play in Orlando, didn't play the whole year. I played six games or whatever. So I always avoid that year out of my mind, but I'll acknowledge it now. I got in shape that next summer. Um went to Washington played for the Wizards. Uh, got hurt after like the six or seventh game or whatever went down, came back the last twenty games of the season, made the playoffs for the first time out there. Whatever had some success, but you know, my nieces, I was backing forth from my knee, and the team didn't know if I could hold up a whole season, so they wanted me to coach and then going to active roster after all Star break, right, And I figured that was a setup. Right. I'm like, they don't even make no sense, thinking like you're gonna ed up coaching the whole year. So I was like, you know what, I'm cool on that. Get a call from Stefan stuff was like what you're doing? I was like chilling. He was like, you're in shape. I was like yeah. He's like you're in shape shape and you know, like stuff is a weird though with all this stuff. He's like you're in shape shape. I'm like, yeah, I'm in shape. He like, come playing China. So I'm like China. He's like, yeah, I can get you like two millions tax for you money, blah blah blah. Just come playing China. So I'm like, I don't know about that. So he called me a week later, he like, you got a team yet? I was like nothing yet. He was like, just come playing Chinese, like staying shape. And he said you'll be done by all star breaking team with people up because you went rhythm. So I'm like, now that makes sense. I was like all right, cool. So I go over there and I go to Fuji and Um and I knew when I was landing that I wasn't gonna make it. I'll tell you like, I came so okay. When they sent me over there, I had to go get my Chinese visa, so I had to stop and hung calm so when you if you know, when you get the asia, like if you don't, you know, do the melotonin thing and get on the pattern, like you would just pass out in the middle of the day and be sleep until like three in the morning, you know what I'm saying. So I did that for three days, like I could not stay up. So I finally wake up and you know, it's my flight. So I get to Fujian and as I'm coming out of the clouds and show I look and it's just like it's like crazy, it's like third world country, like as I'm looking out the window. So at that time, I knew right when I got out the clouds, I was like, oh, I'm not gonna make it out here or whatever. So I went there played there. Um they told me that you know, my center was gonna be the next yeah, I mean or whatever. So I get there and the kid he's good, not great. You know what I'm saying. Our team sucks. You know, we're getting our ass smack in preseason. So after like the fourth preseason game, I went to the GM and it was a lady. Her name was Ricky and she knew nothing about basketball, but she's the GM. She makes all the decisions. So I go to Ricky and I'm like, Ricky, look, you told me this team was good. It's terrible. I was like, I want you to find me a replacement. I want to get out of here. So she's like, okay, okay, she calls my agent. He calls me like, YO, just tough and out blah blah blah blah blah. So I played two games and then I call her back and I'm like, YO, give me out of here, like I'm giving you till Thanksgiving. So long story short, she finds somebody DJ White or whatever. He comes and replaces me. So I come back home. So when I got back after that, you know, no teams was calling. So that's when I realized, like, it's over. You gotta start figuring out what you're gonna do next, you know what I'm saying. And at that time, I had already started working on something you know what I'm saying, which was obviously the cannabis space. So you know, I was able to transition into something else, walk us through this cannabis journey because I tell people like, you're at the forefront of it. And one thing I too, I definitely want to come in you. I think because we're friends and were all type, we really don't show how much we appreciation respect you have we have for you for what you're doing in this space. Man, you're doing some amazing ship across the board. Man. So I just want to congratulate you. Man. It's good to be to see you, you know. I mean I'm looking up to you in this space because I'm in the space as well, but just to see the moves you're making and and how you're giving back and how you're really you know, opening up other athletes eyes and making them realize, Okay, this is something we can invest and we missed. You know, this is our prohibition, this is our this is our this is our goal rush. You know, this is cotton. Yeah yeah, I mean we can eat off this. So I just want to start with that we we appreciate what you're doing in the space, man. So but tell us a little bit what you are what exactly is explained viola to us? Yeah, man, So you know, obviously, you know it all started, you know, back when I was playing with the Denver Nuggets. Um. You know, I was there right when you know that medical program got started, and you know I'm a newspaper guy. I think probably because of our rookie year that they can me get so many newspapers. I got the custom to like just grabbing the newspaper all the time. So while I was there, you know, I was always reading the paper and you know, obviously the sports section a lot of the times, but there was always stuff about cannabis in there, telling stories about you know, kids that have epilepsy and seizures and how cannabis oils was affecting their life, or how people you know that HIV a cancer, you know, how cannabis was giving them a better quality of life, you know, you know in their last days. Um, even just the benefits of cannabis towards glaucoma and other you know, diseases or whatever. So when my grandmother, you know, I convinced her to come see me play out there. Um you know, she got there and you know, we started talking and she started taking all this medication, and I'm maximum, what's wrong with her? And she started telling me these things, and you know, one of them was glaucoma. So I was excited because literally like two days before that, I was reading about reading something in the paper about the benefits of you know, cannabis for glaucoma patients. So I started telling her about it, and you know, I'm calling it cannabis. And then finally she, you know, she asked me, well, what is cannabis? And I was just like, uh, you know, it's marijuana weed. And she was like refa. She's like, you're telling me, Reefa's gonna help me. Like, no way, Reef, We're gonna help me, and she just shuts it down. So the next day I come home and you know, she's sitting in the kitchen and when I walked and she's squinting the eyes and she's like, is that your baby doll? And I'm like, what's up, grandma, and she's like, my eyes are so bad today, I can barely see. So I was like, you take all that medication and it doesn't work. I'm like, why don't we just try cannabis, and you know, we'll just keep it, you know, on the lower two between us, right. And obviously now I'm told millions of people, right, which is cool, but you know, she was just like, I'm in so much pain to day I try anything. So I had my boy go to the dispensary. He brought back Vietnam cush we're vaporizing for in the volcano bag that you could tell neither one experienced smokers, right. She hit the bag three or four times. And why it was funny because when she was smoking it, she was hitting it and blowing it out her nose perfectly like before. Like she's like, not smoked a cigarette one time when I was sixteen whatever. So she hit it, take it downstairs, I take a nap. Wake up from my nap. I'm like, let me go check on her to make sure she ain't done in climbing. The walls are going crazy, and I go downstairs and the doors closed, so that I was like, really what to expect, right, So I knocking the door, and when I poked my head through the door, her backs are doing She's looking down and I'm just like, Grandma, how are you doing? And she turned around and she's crying tears and she's like, I'm healed. I haven't been able to see the words of my Bible and over three years. So she was downstairs reading a Bible. And you know, if anybody know anything about Viola harringson bro, Like I mean, if she's not going to heaven. We're all going to help sure we don't have a chance. Like when my grandfather died and young, she never remarried. She married the lord and she was the treasury at the church. She ran all of the communion like she the one for her ex first experience with cannabis and for her to go read a Bible to me was like guys talking to me, you know what I'm saying. So it just inspired me to start learning you know what I'm saying. And now I'm starting to take these newspaper articles way more serious. Damn, this is this is this is something that obviously we've been lied to for a very long time, but this is something that can really like help people. Like I said, I went through the education process. That next year, I called, um, you know, my co founder, you know, because he was the only person that I knew that had some you know, experience in growing cannabis, and we came to Colorado. We looked around at all these different opportunities. I asked me, I said, you think you can do this? He was like yes, And we found our first building, a twelve thousand square foot facility and Denver, Colorado. We became caregivers in the beginning, so all of our patients either had HIV a cancer, so we used to go strange that was heavy Indica, and uh, that's how we started, bro. And you know, we started there and you know, inten is when you know, we got issued our first license, so we had to name the business something. And you know, obviously you know, we sat there and we decided we wanted to name it after the person that inspired us to get to this point, and you know, we named the Viola. So that's how Viola got started. What are some of the stuff, I know, what's important to you in this space. I mean, you're not doing it for the financial game. You did well for yourself and in sports and other investments, But tell us why what drives you in this space and be honest. Like when I first started, you know what I'm saying, it was about you know, being able to have some extra cash in my pocket and help people. Right. Um. Once I started realizing how the you know, the candidates that we was growing, how it really was medicine, how it was really helping and affecting people, I was like, Yo, we're doing God's work, Bro, We're doing something with something that's very natural. You know what I'm saying. This is something that is grown. It can be grown anywhere. All you needed sunlight and water. That's not a drug Compared to all this other stuff that they recommend that we use. We take too many of them, we die. Um, you know, most times whatever we're taking, the other side effects of works and the thing that we're trying to cure, you know what I'm saying. So that's when I realized. I was like, Yo, this is God's work man, And you know, it really just inspired me to, you know, leave basketball alone for the most part completely. You know I did. I played in the Big Three or whatever, and that was more just to be able to hang out with my guys kicking on the weekends and stuff like that. But my day to day businesses has been cannabis. And as I've been going through this journey, I realized, like, obviously I'm having a lot of wins and a lot of success, but when I go to these different events and different things like that, I'm the only one in the room that looks like me. And when I think about, you know, how cannabis was used to pretty much tear down you know, the black and Latino community now that there's this billion dollar industry and we have no representation, Like I have a huge issue with that. That's really bullshit. And once I started to realize that, I was like, wow, Like, you know, obviously we're doing we're doing our part in regards of you know, building a brand and you know, helping people with the medicine, right, but what are we doing to uplift our people? What opportunities are we providing for them? And when I asked myself that at that time, I didn't have any answers. At that point is when I decided to, you know, pivot our company and you know, our company now is a lifestyle cannabis brand with purpose, and our purpose is about empowering and up lift in the black community. All people. They always want to talk about jobs and this and that, Like your jobs are cool, you know what I'm saying, But like we want ownership, you know what I'm saying. Like I said, when you think about you know, eighty five per cent of all drug arrests and the Black community all cannabis related, you know what I'm saying, and we only represent three percent of diversity and cannabis. How does that even make sense. I feel like what I'm doing is putting myself to be have a seat at the table, and by me having to seat at the table, I can now come back and turn back and talk to my brothers about it and tell them the opportunities the best ways to come into this, because you know, to me, I think it's ridiculous, like you know, for any players, you know, moving forward, especially NBA players because of our brotherhood, right, and you know you can get in touch with me anyway, but to jump into the space without giving me a call just makes no sense, you know what I'm saying, because I know now, like you know, you know what's gonna make money, what's really the longevity and cannabis. What's amazing is that you know, to be honest, Like you know, I've been having conversation with y'all for a while, for years, right, and every time I've talked to you all about it. You know, it seems like I'm an expert, right, But what I know now compared to what I knew then, I didn't know. Ship you understand what I'm saying, but now I'm like ten years in. One of the challenges we're gonna have is going to be capital, right, and you know that's why, you know, I try to reach out to many players and entertainers and you know, people that look like me and that share, you know, share the same interest in cannabis because we all smoke it, we all love it, we enjoy it as part of our lifestyle. And trying to get them to let's partner up and do this together because you know, I feel like, you know, just in sports, you know what I'm saying, Like Instagram, all these different things, all these things are built off of us, right, and we don't get paid for it. Right. So imagine if all the athletes from all sports deciety, like we're gonna start our own Instagram, would it would kill Instagram. It would be bigger than Instagram, you know what I'm saying. But it's something. It's something in our DNA. I don't know if it's a competitive gene or something that doesn't allow us to come together. It's just something and I guess it's from the four hundred years of you know, what has been ingrained in us. That's probably is what discycle that we can't break it this time. But to your point, like what you said, like this is generational wealth at risk, like these little hundred million dollar contracts and ship like that. In the grand scheme of things of the world and real wealth, that's nothing. That's not It's people that spend a hundred million dollars in a day sometimes you understanding they can do that, you know what I'm saying. So it puts into things in perspective. And you know, my whole thing is just like you know when you know one of our new monic because is what is your purpose? My purpose now is obviously you know number one is to take care of my family, and obviously I have to do that first, right um. The second thing is literally trying to figure out a way to empower and impact other people lives. You know what I'm saying. I took you all the time I had to. I had to. That's time my lives already. I've done the boats, I've done the private planes, I've under crazy trips, I've had the craziest dinners and all that. You know, I say, what's next? What else can you do? That's what I'm trying to instill in my company's culture through everybody throughout it. We're gonna build a brand, We're gonna scale a brand with purpose, and we're gonna do it with excellence, you know what I'm saying. And that's how we're gonna rock. And while we do that, we're gonna help a lot of people, you know what I'm saying. The gold of mine is to create a hundred millionaires in the next three years. We have another company that we go at the licenses or whatever. And you know, we just won two states. One states announced, the other states not announced that so I can't announce it. But between those three opportunities, those two those two licenses that we just won, I just made eight of my homeboys millionaires. Dudes that came from nothing, had nothing, you know what I'm saying. And I was able to, you know, provide opportunity that will allow them to you know, become millionaires. Bro, you know what I'm saying. So like that's what I'm trying to do with Viola, you know what I'm saying. And I just hope and pray that one day I could get to support of my other brothers that's like me, so that we can really go out here and really impact the world, like people die for ship like this, what we're trying to do you know what I'm saying, Like, for real, you know what I'm saying, you try to uplift the whole, you know, generation of people. You know what I'm saying, And you know what we need to realize is like you know, I'm not racist by any means, but I'm woke. We live in the NBA and all that type of ship. We live in a different worlds, not the real world, right, but I've allowed myself to be vulnerable and be accessible to the real world. You know what I'm saying in our generation and our race to our generation, but our race is last bro of course, what I'm saying like everything has more rights than Black people when you really think about it, right, I feel like the only way that we can change this cycle is we're gonna have to do it through you know, economic growth and coming together, you know what I'm saying, and creating our own ship. That's hours that can nobody take from us. And I have so many ideas if us as black athletes came together and we can do stuff that you know, we talk about creating an environment where our families never have to work again. We can do it. We just got to do it together. Put our egos aside. We all get one percent, we all get half a percent of something that's gonna be worth trillions of dollars. You understand what I'm saying. Now, That's how we make sure our family never ever struggle again, you know what I mean. So you know that's what Viola is about. Bro. We're just getting started, you know. And you know, I feel like, you know, five ten years from now, you know, I think number one hundred millionaire hundred millionaires goal will be accomplished, and then after that I could turn into thousands that we're trying to change the narrative. Man, it's it's our time, man, It's just it's been too long. We're too talented. You know. There's too many industries before us that we pioneered that we don't have no ownership in. And I think that obviously because of those times, and I don't feel like we had the proper resources to be able to take advantage of the opportunity. But this fucking time, if we don't and we end up customers again, we fucking played ourselves. And it's and that's and that's it, period. I like it. So you're big on the evolution of I mean, like you said, it's been going on for a long time, but really kind of bring it to the forefront. I take pride in this as well. It's kind of being the shield for guys that are playing right now. We can talk about it, we can educate, we can continue to spread our arms and empower people. But athletes are still stuck. We're still punished for it. Guys losing their career, they're losing money, painted as a bad person because of this, you know, so so talk about a little bit about how you feel cannabis and professional sports go hand in hand. Yeah. So, you know when I first started in the league, you know, I was one of the guys that when I was a square, I was like, what they're doing you know what I'm saying, They're not really doing nothing to help our calls being winners and all that. So I used to do the people like you always never helped. But I ain't know, bro, I ain't know, you know, you know, I grew up in that area where I was afraid. I was one taught that if I smoke weed, I was gonna be a crackhead. Like who wanted to be a crackhead? I used to see crackheads in the corner of shake it and you know, no clothes on. I don't want it, wants that, so I'm not gonna smoke no weed to end up like that. You can forget about compare. But that's when. That's where I was from. That's how I was then. I've seen people getting locked up for it all the time, you know what I'm saying. So you know the other thing, I definitely Harrington does not want to go to jail. So cannabis was just wasn't on my radar. So you know, obviously, once I had my experience, and it took for me to have my experience because I've seen y'all use, I've seen y'all smoke, and I've seen y'all still be successful, right, But I still at that time, I felt like it wasn't for me. But once I got introduced to it, and then once I educated myself on the medicinal benefits of it, it made me just go back and think about my career and what I put my body through. And you know, I was hurt a lot of the time I played. All the time I played hurt, I didn't miss a lot of games. I was you know, I've always had knee something by bothering my knee in my back whatever. And you know what the trainers did. They just gave me antime, matorious anything. It gave me muscle relaxes, you know, if it was really bad, they give me you know, the good stuff, the ox season or whatever. Right, just whatever it took for me to be comfortable enough for being back on the court, to get out there on the court and play. Once I educated myself, I realized all the side effects and all these different things because I took anti inflammatories for seven and a half straight years, bro two in the morning, one at night. And I needed that just to be able to get up and feel good enough to go out and work on my craft in the way I felt like I needed to. And you know, when you think about all the side effects, like I said, potentially, and you know, I'm still living right, so the effects may be coming. You don't have to happen right now that I made filio those effects when I turned fifty or something. But could you imagine if I was educated enough to know, and I had accessible cannabis, you know what I'm saying, Why I could take a tincture under my under my tongue, or I could use a topical and rubbing on my my areas where I'm in pain. And you know, when I realized that, and you know, talking to other athletes, and you know, once I started becoming more of an advocate, more athletes coming to me like, Yo, we love what you're doing. This is ridiculous. We should be able to be able to have access. That's when I started to speak on it, and it inspired me to you know, start aligne products that you know, professional athletes could have access to that had you know, zero percent T a C. Which is obviously the main concern with sports leagues is that one property or that one cannabinoid in the plant. It's T A C is what's really banned. So you know, I started my company, Herrington Wellness, and you know, my first line that I launched is replay you know, so as a replay him extract product um that you know I use for recovery, you know. And you know, one of the reasons why when I got done playing, or inspired me to push me out the league was my knee. Like I could not get swelling out of my knee. And because of the swelling, it always you know I was always in pain. That's the same that you went article across seas and had that surgy. I went to I went to right, I went to Germany. Me I had a procedure. I had every single procedure you could have here in the United States trying to figure out my knee and not until I've finished my formulation to replay and was able to use it and use it consistently, that all the information is out of my knee. And that's the only reason why I was able to play in the Big Three was because of this cream that I had made um and because nothing else was working. Now that you know I had these products, and you know it's not only my company's other companies that are doing you know that that have products and stuff like that. But you know, I feel like CBD is going to be the gateway into professional sports. And I think that people need to wrap their head around at all. Cannabis isn't bad and even the t A C side is not bad. You know what I'm saying, is it still that stigma on it that we are every day changing and you know, one of the things that I prided myself on, and you know, having people like you know, stack being you know, very supportive when we played in the Big Three. You know what I'm saying, We we let everybody know about our cannabis because to me, once again, it was changing because me and him was the best two players in the league, right we both had all these other things going on. He's doing TV, I'm running my company, and we use cannabis every day. And look at the success, look at the winds that we're having while we're using it. And I thought that was very important that we did that and to let people know, like, look, man, like I'm a father for you know, I manage a business, I manage a household, I manage all my other investments, I managed family. I still hoop and I smoke weed every day. And that's not true that when you smoke, you're gonna be stuck on the couch, and especially when you have access to CBD, CVD is not going to do nothing. But actually, hell, I think that, you know, obviously, with Baseball made the huge announcement that they're no longer testing in the minor league. They never testing the big leagues anyway, but making that announcement now says that pretty much cannabis is legal man. I'm surprised that they did it first, you know what those what I was, I'm not because there was never testing for it, but was really what was really unique about it is that there was no backlash, zero like none zero. It was on Sports Center one day. They might have touched on it the next day because it was having those meetings and that was it. Why do you think that is? I think because no one care. The fans do not care if players have access to cannabis. I don't think they care anymore because it doesn't affect the game. It does not affect what they do. And you gotta remember we're professionals, right, so possibility comes with we can drink to We can drink as much as we like to drink. On players like to drink. So you like to drink, you like to smoke, Right, you don't show up to the game's drunk. It's responsibility. How many teammates. I've had one teammate that showed up to a game drunk, but he was not playing. He was in the back, you know what I'm saying. He was sitting on the bench, he wasn't playing. I'm just not about to go and lace him up against Stephen Jackson or Matt Barnes and gonna go get high before I do that, play Katie or a game. I'm not blowing like I'm about to go like know you know what it right, bro. But what I'm saying is like we are with professionals, you know what I'm saying. And I think that fan bases understand that too. And you may have one or two guys, you know what I'm saying. Every sport has that one guy that has, you know, problems beyond you know what we can actually speak speak on. You know what I'm saying. And those are the guys that you have one bad apple. But you know, if you live of players use cannabis, man, I just think it makes it for a better league, you know. I think you know, with players put themselves through to get themselves ready to play the game, go through all the emotions of the game, within the game, after the game, and what we do is we run the liquor and we tell, go get me a bottle of sarat Go give me a bottle of do say? And you know we're sitting there and we're drinking, and now we drink to the point where you know, if you know if we're going to the next city or whatever, like you know, you're dehydrated, for um, you offer your game obviously, And just imagine if and I know players would do this because we all we're all looking or advantage right to feeling better, you know what I'm saying, Like it was one thing I laughed about all times. Like me and Wilson Chandler, two players that I know that have tried every in any kind of workout, medicine, uh, supplement that would make you feel better. I have not found anything as good as cannabis. So, like I said, just imagine after a game, a trainer walks around with a gummy bear, you know what I'm saying, with the edible that's you know, a hundred milligrams CBD at five percent T a C and gives that to a player. He takes that and allows him to start to relax. And as we know, right and as we know, you know the cannabinois, you know, it's a it's a natural anti inflammatory and like you said, it helps you sleep. So it's just so much good that comes from it. So I think that NHL is gonna be next. I think NFL's definitely after that because they got their collective bargaining, so they may end up being before NHL. But I wouldn't be surprised the NHL did it this season just from some people I know, and then the NBA is gonna have to do it, and they're open to it, you know. Adam understands that, and you know, I think that if any player ever decided to take that step, as far as we're saying, it's his right to use cannabis, especially players that play in cities or states that it's legal. Because with the state that you live in says that it's medicinely legal for you to have access to it if a doctor prescribes you for it. So how can the league tell you that you can't get the medicine that you're and they don't want that, you know what I'm saying. So you know, it could be forced if it had to be, But I think that, you know, the Players Association, you know, they're very open to it. You know, obviously I talked to Michelle Roberts and Chris Paul and them guys all the time. Uh, they're on board, you know, they they they they're they're supportive of what we're doing. And you know, now they're just waiting for just you know, small things, you know, like some form of a stamp of approval or or stamp that can say that these products are t a C free and but outside of the cannabis. So they're looking forward from somewhere FDA, someone like FDA certified the different things like that, And those are the things that I'm working on, you know what I'm saying, trying to figure that out. But you know, we're very close, and you know, I think that all of our work is about to come to a head, and I think the player is about to have access anything. I really, like I said before we started this conversation, I mean, you've we've all kind of done it, you know what I mean. Like my I didn't try to keep it a secret, but you know, I smoked, so I came out right out the gates, you know what I mean. Post career, we did that Bleach report ship and kind of started running with it, you know, I mean, so it was really my goal. I kind of felt like it was my responsibility because I got popped towards the end of my career. I was getting drug tested when I was in Memphis, when I played for Memphis. I was getting drugs testing once a week and still smoking, and still you didn't, you know. I mean, I just made it work. But to me, there's no other alternative. Like you said, I'm someone who I take a peel, my my stomach hurts. I mean, I'm not really a drinker. I'm a social drinker. I'm not a sit back and just drink my sorrows away. So I've just always smoked that. I just knew what it did for me, you know. So the fact that there's now medical research backing that up, you know what I mean. And because we can talk about it, you know, we can talk about our stories who were blue in the face. But until we started getting this these research behind us, when people start listening, you know what I mean. So I just think our experiences, like you said at the top of the line, you know the one percent, and you know professional athletes are one percent. If we can be functional and professional athletes and fathers and business owners and doing all this productive ship like, there has to be something to it, you know. Like I said, I got popped, and he said, there's probably over two hundred dudes in the in the drug program for weed alone, and there's four D players in the NBA. And I always say, like, I think it's n of us to use cannabis in some shape, form and fashion. And obviously one thousand percent in the all season. You know what I'm saying, Like I see I could see like a Steph Curry, you know what I'm saying, like with his wife on vacation, Like let's take this at a brier. Yeah, like what's wrong with nothing? You shouldn't be penalized for that. But imagine and if someone like a Lebron or a k D or something like that and came out to yah, yeah, I medicated to help me with Lebron spent at one point, it would probably take off that one point five milli dollar a year Lebron is paying for his body if he would you know, I mean he was because imagine that he would take someone like that. Katie did take a big step down because they invested in that cannabis company Canada. I think I think cannabis investments. I mean, you know there's players that you know that are definitely investing in stuff. But you know, to our point, like you know, they're using, they're using, they're using more and there's more in the open than it was when we was and we was doing it. You know what I'm saying, Like we never sat in the club. Who smoke? We did everything? No, not not in not did now y'all just smoked, like in the club in front of everybody, Like, who didn't you didn't you? It was not that you want to call somebody right now right every teammate was not sing this kid, I'm called, are you kidding? They've been out the game too long? It was not, it was not. It was not. We were sitting in our area. He used to be standing up smoking with his shot and that was when New Year's was one time who we got on the phone, tell her we feel it right now. We felt we feel it right out. Dude, he had to ask you something, but I got a serious question for you. Do tell her what Al said? First, Al said, I don't know where he was at the time. Unbelievable, But Al said, we didn't smoke in the club when we wasn't Golden State. He said, were rolling. It don't matter, we're rolling, it don't matter. We're smoking right now? Said he said, Al didn't. Al didn't. I'm about to argue with them, y'all got did, but you gotta think just like you said, you just smoked to the second year. Yeah, I told every club by this, What do you mean? We tipped each bouncer ahead of dollars? We was good. So anyway you're bad? Yeah, where were you? We forgive you? Where were you? But anyway, like I said, you're like, now, these I just don't feel like like these motherfuckers shit in the middle of this because of what we did right we started. Yeah, these guys are using so you know, I think that the numbers is like staggering and like how many players actually use use cannabis now? So you know, it's time for a change, and it's coming. It's gonna happen soon and later. I think we haven't even sooner than I thought, because a year I think we did our bleached the report thing. I think we said three to five years or whatever I was a year ago, So it might be right, might be right the third year. I think next year there going it's gonna be some movement. I think so. But talk about you know, rest in peace. The conversation you have had with Stern kind of the entry way, you know what I mean, because he was someone that was Stern was his his reputation speak. He was mafia, you know what I mean. And to sit down with him after he had handed the reins off the Adam and in the in the open, real conversation you guys had that made real headwaves. Yeah, man, it was obviously you know I didn't. It wasn't in the game plan, right, you know what I'm saying. I never was in my mind thinking like I gotta eventually talk to David Stern about this happened organically, you know what I'm saying. I was in at this Milk and conference here in l A. He was on the panel. You know. I went to go see him speak and afterwards, you know, walked up to me and the first thing he said was how's your knee? And I was just like, it's like, it's crazy as memory I'm saying them like I'm al Aaronson and whatever and all these players like for you to remember that was crazy. But he's like, how did you need doing? I was like it's all right, but a little blah, and you know, I start telling him, you know what I was. He was like, what are you doing on here? So I was just like I'm just trying to learn, and you know, I'm trying to figure out what I'm doing do next. But I was like, right now, I'm in the cannabis space and you know, and he was just like, yeah, I live in uh, I live in Aspen and it's all kind of dispensaries everywhere, you know, I drive past them all the time. And I was like, yeah, that's what I'm doing now. And I was just like, uh, you know, also, I want to figure out the way, you know, for players to have access to cannabis like that. And he's like, oh, no, hell no, blah blah blah blah blah whatever whatever. And I was just like, no, I'm telling you you gotta look at I said, you should look at it. It's more information out there now. You should let me come talk to you about it. And he was like fine. So it took me like eight months to get on this schedule, like literally like eight months, bro. So eight months later, I'm in New York. He tells me to come by and you know, he's so busy or whatever. He gave me like a twenty minute time slot at twenty minutes to meet with him. And I get there and you know, we started talking, and you know, my grandmother's story breaks the ice for everybody, like humanizes the plant. You know. I feel like, you know what I'm saying, at least what people are willing to be open minded enough to have a conversation at that point. And when I told him that, you know, he was just like wow, and you know, he's like, that's an emotional story. And then I just start telling about the players. I was just like, you know, you know, and I started with the whole responsibility thing. I was just like, you know, players aren't gonna come high. And then you know, he mentioned like back when he first took over, like that was a real that they was on co He was just like, you'll be amazed, guys will come you know, the game. I was talking to Jerry West the other day about something like that. When he was coaching. He was telling me something. I'm like, what as the coach, and then he knew. I was just like, damn right, it was worse he's telling him. So we're talking. So then I just I walked him through the day of a player for the most part, was like my first you know, and I just like, yo, you know, I said, you probably noticed, but I said, you know, we wake up, we showered last music, get ourselves riled up, get to the stadium, you know, go through film, get riled up, play, go through the most of the game, and you know how it is with officials and the coaches and the fans. And I was like, you know, we really trained our by these like we train our bodies for real to play for four hours, right, we played twenty minutes, you know what I'm saying. So after the game were still on one. We need something, like, we need something something to bring us down. The thing that we've reached for is the most unhealthy thing ever alcohol alcohol. Then we have injuries and ship like that in the first for the opioids and that's the worst ship ever. So you know, I explained that to him and the flights and this, and I said, I imagine we get an edible, we get a tincture, and get to the point where we can ask for some specific strains that we know that we'll do whatever we need, you know what I'm saying for recovery. He was just like, I never thought about it like that. That's a very very interesting way to look at it. And you know, he was like you know, we should talk again with to New York again, and we chopped it up again, and this time I had more research and I had like some paperwork that I gave him and stuff. And then that's when I asked me. I was like, you mind going on camera let me interview about this, and he was just like, let me read up some about it or whatever. And then he called me back a week later and he was like, I'll do a enterview with you know problem. So we did the interview, um and you know, because he's an attorney, you know, he's not gonna say anything he don't want to say or you don't mean. So here I go me and the producers or whatever, trying to craft questions to get him to say, like players to have access to cannabis. Put in a roundabout way. I had list of seventeen questions. And it's impressive, man, you asked me all these questions without having something. But I'm looking. I'm like, and I go through first question, second question, third question, and literally he says the ship like said it. Bro. He's like, yo, players should have access to cannabis, and you know, they should really look at this policy. It doesn't make any sense anymore. You know, it's it's it's it's it's now documented. You know, information that says that, you know, it's beneficial. And I looked at the producer, like what else you want me to do? That's all I came for. Like you said, it came out and you know the pack that it had, you know what I'm saying. Um, obviously, I think it definitely. You know, it was a hit amongst you know, the brotherhood and the players and all that, obviously, but I think you know, with the commissions of these leagues and stuff like that, they had to take a look. I was speaking for all of us, you know what I'm saying, every sport, you know what I'm saying, And he was speaking for all the sports. And I think that, you know, someone especially like him because you know, he was a tyrant. You know, he didn't play, you know, it was his way of the you know what I mean. And for him to say that, I think because everyone knows how he is, they had to look at it. I think that that's why that you know, that video was so impactful. And it's crazy too, because you know, I've been meaning every time I go to New York I've been meaning to hit him up and then next year, you know, you know, he dropped that, you know for the most part, so you know, it sucks. You know, a lot of people after that the interview, they just knew that he was like, uh on an investor, like everybody, that's a first question. He's an investor, He's investor room like No. But you know, one of the things I was gonna ask some was actually, like to be on the board of my company, because I would been amazing just to have in sight a building business and changing, you know, the way people because you know, people proceed the NBA a certain way as a drug league and it's too black, too drug. And he had a vision. We talked about this on the Jump the a couple of weeks ago with Rachel you know what I mean. He had his vision of but he his ideals and what he did and and branding individual player like he had this whole play. So I may only imagine him sitting on your board. Would have guided you guys. So that's what I mean with you know, with with doing with excellence is having more access to people. That's how we're gonna win, bro, We're gonna win in this industry. I don't know how that. I don't know how it's gonna go, but we're gonna win. The mess is gonna get out on this. This is gonna be one of our you know what I mean. We've all we've had some dope shows, but this one is so educational. Like I said, this is you know how important this is to me. You know what I mean, and I know how important it is to you. And to just keep pushing the word, you know what I mean? And like you said, everybody can do ship individually and probably be successful, but together we would be unstoppable town. Like we could like have ownership talking about jobs and sillery jobs. Anybody, man, you see this, any athletes, pass it to your homeboys, you see it? Hit me up, hit al up, hit jack up. Come together, come join our team and let's take this ship over. Man. Let's get on the NBA bro home stretch, get on the NBA. Let you think about the NBA today, how do you feel about it? It's cool, Um, I don't really like to watch it, you know what I'm saying. Um, I just you know I'm not a fan of a hundred and thirty four hundred and games you know what I'm saying. And I just feel like it should be more pride defensively, you know what I'm saying. That. I know they changed the game to the point where you can't touch, you know what I'm saying, But I think that it just needs to be more pride defensively, man. And then the whole life just some sometimes it almost seems like they don't care as much because they don't play. That's just how the game is. That's not everybody, but that's just some people. Like it's so see out there. It's just like damn, like are you kidding me? Like and then the resting, and it's like then you rest, you don't play the games. It's like when we came up, the game was the show. We took pride and playing eighty two games, playing four games and five nights. That's less practice that we have to really used to have to practice, you know what I mean, Like we go to war like I remember with stan Van Gundy, we used to motherfucker have to have taped angles and kneepaths and shoot around bro. Like we got to it, you know what I mean, We got to it. So it's funny too because like we're not even now. I'm two years removed. So when you talk like this, you're a hater. You're this year that. It's not that at all. This the game has completely changed. To me, I don't have as much as I respect the fact because it's it's continued to evolve. This is the sterns playing, you know, a global game. So people want to see highlights. They want to see three pointers, dunks and high scores. They don't want to see a defensive battle. They don't want to see a Detroit, Indiana tie. They do, but if there's no fight, like, who wants to see game? You mean, so the game is involved, But I feel what you're saying. It's just like it just doesn't seem like that competition and it's just you know, it's just threes. You just run around shoot threes. And I talked to an official yesterday, Um that's into space, and he said to me, he's like, you know, these guys are just so it's changing. You guys have been going. He's like, oh, they do it, shoot threes and they drops the whole they touch when they want to free throw. You know what I'm saying. So it's just but the game is, but the skill level they got incredible. They would today's game. I think I'd be solid. You know, I could do it, you know what I'm saying. But it wouldn't have been no inside. I just have to do everything from the outside. I wish I'd have been cool with because I had handled and then I can shoot. I think I would have been able to make this transition for you, you know what I'm saying. I mean when I came in the league and we came in, it was inside out ball shagged. Had to touch the inside before you even But by the time we was on the end and it was like yeah, and after yeah, it was like kind of done. You know what I'm saying. Now you book at Like I went to go see uh Oklahoma City play um the paces in the big Kid Turner. You know, he didn't touch the paint one time on the offensive. Then like I watched the I was near the entire game on the floor, and he did not touch the paint on the offensive in one possession. Bro Crashing not just I'm like, what, like, what is going on? He's seven, but he's skilled. I'm just like, then, but you're not gonna touch the paint one time. We're gonna get one offensive rebound, one switch, nothing. But that's how the game is played. But you know, like I said, you know it's not it's not what I like to watch. For now, maybe when my kids get into it, I can get back in. So there's not no players you like to watch. Oh yeah, of course I like I should play. I like, you know, I like to I like Katie obviously. You know Brian is you know, my my goat. He let's talk about that. So you got give me your top three Brian Mike uh uh probably like shock all of them buckets Cold gave you, and you're just not gonna disrespect him. I'm not disrespecting him, just saying you asked me who my top is, saying who gave you more buckets? The Cold Code for said who gave you more buckers? At all of them? Think right, gave me all of us together, you get a lot of Code bucks. Stop it. Gold was Cold. I mean, Cod was the guy. But I'm asking Broad is the best player because I feel like, just because you talk about the best basketball player, not the best killer instinct, you understand what I'm saying, the fact that he can play all five positions, the fact that he's done this ship for seventeen years consistently, no drop off at any time, and we've been saying, well, we're not we're big teeth in right now, like you're really feeling this. But I'm saying he's the best all around player of all times. There's no question. Don't give him that. But if you ask me, do I gotta start with I gotta start an organization and I need a bad motherfucker could him. No, I'm going with Mike. Really, I'm going with Mike. Yeah, going with Mike. But outside of that, it's him dog hands down, that over magic Bird, all of them. Yeah, no matter that I'm not who don't win the Clippers leg us. The only thing that the Clippers that scared me is because they keep doing all these dudes not playing and all that kind of rest. I don't know those too, but but you know it's something to be said about, you know, you like respected, I'm not mad at it because you gotta build that camaraderie and that feel for each other. They're like, they're not like that to me, Like you know, you know, PG, it's still like evolving, you know, it's not like he had like a killer playoffs series before, you know what I'm saying. So it's not like he just proved improving where you're like, you knowing the playoffs, he's about to just turn it up to the contract. That's what he got. No, he got a game. But I'm not listen, I'm not saying you don't have game or none of that. I'm just saying it's not like you know PG to be like when the playoffs come taking That's all I'm saying. So all I'm saying is like I feel like, you know, Kauai was able to do that last year. You know what I'm saying that, Like that's rare, Like it's not a lot of players that can go ending out the lineup and all that, getting that and go here, that's go o second time. Right, Okay, So he's done it twice, so that my point being is like he's known for that, right, PG is not known for that, you know what I'm saying that nobody else on their team. So all I'm saying is like I would like to see them play more games together and start and take the season serious. They're taking it like this, see they take the Lakers game serious. They take that, but that's what I'm saying. So my whole thing is like, I don't know how that's gonna end up. I will say that I feel like the Lakers are taking every game serious, so because of that, that might play into it. If they don't. You know, if they don't like serious, it's up. The Clippers have me doing fifty cushups. So what I'm saying real quick, with the injuries you had through at your career, if load management with the thing, you think that would have put some years on your career. Um, if you really just sat because like I said, I tell people, because we entervieed the markets too, I said, we have to be protected from ourselves. Like at the end of that, we want to get out there. But if they have this research now backing it up that if you rest here there and I feel what I feel both sides like fans want to come see you play. But at the end of the day, if it's about winning championships is what we make everything about, why would you not want your players to be the absolute most rest that could be. Knowing the fucking were and tear our bodies take. You know, we both all know how firsthand our bodies say, so we're strategically rest throughout the season and start revving up at the right time. To me, post playoffs is the right time and start getting on. That's how fast we have, man. I mean, I understand it's more of just as I just don't respect it because I think that the part of the reason why it's the eighty two games season and all that is because it's a it's the is the journey is the journey. But so it's like I want to be tired in the end. I want want you to. I want to I want to tired and see all that. But why why I say it's different with that too, is because these kids now are playing more games before they get to where we're at. You played a lot of games because you came straight from high school. Excuse me, but the AU system. Now these kids are playing so much games, their bodies are so worn down by the time they get to where the one percent get that their knees when they're coming in at a team, their knees are twenty seven. Yeard needs manage it down there, manage it when I'm paying I'm coming out to watch you play. Maybe maybe that's the real talk that ship manage you because is the journey, you know. And then I feel what you're saying. But to me, like having kids in the game, I understand it now, you know. I mean, so I'm looking at it like this next generation, like it's if it's strategically done, it's the right thing to do. Like I have no problem. And we talked to lou Will. Lou Will said us hurt management, like he look he liked, Yeah, he want to play. I know about it. You know what I'm saying. He loved a whop. So I figured that they just they didn't want the media. Like his knees messed up his back, so I figured he was something's bobbing us. I've been talking about. Yeah, I'm talking about even guys on teams that it's not playing for a championship, I mean and doing low men and telling him or god us in his second year still developed, developing. We're not gonna tell you the rest of the year, what is going on? Bro? I hear. That's to go back and touching. What I said was what this what's coming out now is it's not even a you. It's the middle school basketball because they're not even learning nothing. So it's making it's making them worse. And they're playing a middle school basketball the whole school year getting hurt in that time. He was fine because they traveling, they learned a lot middle school and not learning nothing. So that's waste of the time. And that's why a lot of them getting hurt in middle school. That's like said, the school balls for nothing. Now, like like, that's why I'm culturing my kids, Like I'm not letting them get wrapped up in even if basketball is love what they do for this what they do, but just it's such a dirty ground. But I like what you said, Like, man, thats how to dribble, like you to shoot, run, jumped the driven to not teach them drill. Just make sure you don't teach yourself how to phone his face and bust his motherfucking face over to get a whole new grill and flattened his nose out. But you know you once we all got new parlies over here. I'm talking about him. Turn a lot of ship, anybody, Man, let's get back to this ship. We've got the final um one of the one of the l A team. You think, so the Battle of l A is gonna year finals winner. Whoever wins, that's gonna win the finals. This shouldn't be that shouldn't be that horrified. No, out of the East. No, I'm just periods. Yeah, it's uh so it's one of the teams out of l A because that's fair, and I'm gonna go with Milwaukee. It should be Milwaukee. But I just feel like sunk could get shut down. So not Philly, Boston, just Boston, just because I think I think the Kimber factor, the Kimber factor should step in. I just feel like with with Philly there's some leadership issues there and like somebody can't. I think it's somebody got to take charge and it's just like that out and then obviously they playing well too. But I don't know Away. Yeah, I don't know anybody on the team but him, but they are a good team. But yeah, I would say I would say Boston and one of the l A teams. So the rivalry back, that's another vision they had, right, they want those two teams to be viola, let's do it final party. So you got the Lakers, Boston, Lakers, Boston party of Viola, party of we're winning, like I got the Clippers winning. But to me, whoever wins about is gonna win the final No disrespect to the rest of leage. That's just what it is. Last question. People you could sit, smoke and just be creative as funk with in my life are alive? Who's at your table? Not kind of me and Jack give some other people space, all right, So I gotta have Bead there, just like to you know, for everything, you gotta explain that and see the whole thing, make sure it all makes sense. Uh. I want to smoke with Obama? Yeah? Um, I want to smoke with like legends, and I want Bob there just to hit the herb with him. Young Marley Damn. Who else would I want to smoke with? Um? You know I'm on some history ship, so like you know, just better learn and do like so Marcus Garvey, I got a smoke with him. So that's what we're waiting for you to go that type of ship. Um, and then I'll probably just have another like entertainer. Uh. Who would I want to smoke? I don't know, somebody like Lenny Kravis, none other Cravits, Jimmy Hendricks. When you said somebody finding it was funny because the way he had Eddie Murphy is he had somebody had Obama two? It is too beat beat my Eddie Murphy perfect every man, that's a rap. All the Smoke, legendary episode. Man, I think this episode is gonna make a lot of headways, hope of us. You know, we got to bring people together. Um. Athletes need to be able to smoke. We need to love each other. We're gonna smoke anyway regardless. Uh Man, hell of the show. I thank you for having man. Hold on, let me wipe. What's going on with Chad? Let me sla him moist? Don't want to feel it. You don't want to feel it? Has not more with two of us. You play with you. I forgot to hold through and sweatshirt. You want it to be changed. Don't don't do me like that is not get petty. It is nice and wet bron I thought she was playing with yourself down there. That's crazy on on camera too. The biggest hayter Man, catch you Thursday. All the smoke, the biggest what I got, Al Harrington, I'm too fresh to be still that's the rat man. All the smoke. Great episode with my brother Al. Uh. Check this out on Showtime Basketball YouTube are all platforms, streaming podcast. Everything she does is because she never loses sight of what's important. Putting on a military transport tonight. Hell yes, No one's backing down on either side. We have a bona fide crisis. We'll follow it up together, get to the truth. I did what had to be done.