Caroline Ellison, former co-CEO of Alameda Research and Sam Bankman-Fried’s ex-girlfriend, spent 3 days on the stand this week. Ellison recently pled guilty to financial fraud, and is cooperating with the prosecution.
In this episode Lidia Jean Kott discusses Caroline’s testimony with Jacob Goldstein, financial reporter and author of the book Money.
This conversation was recorded in the evening on October 12.
Questions for Michael? Submit them by clicking the link in our show notes or visiting atrpodcast.com
To access bonus episodes, and to listen to all of our coverage ad-free, sign up for Pushkin plus on the Against The Rules show page in Apple Podcasts or at Pushkin.fm/plus.

Here’s the Scoop from NBC News: Looking Ahead to Politics in 2026 with Steve Kornacki and Ryan Nobles
30:43

Live with Nicolle Wallace
40:31

Michael Burry Speaks
36:22