The volume. The three and OW Podcast with me John Middlecoff is presented by FanDuel Sports Book. There's no better place to make every moment more than with FanDuel. Great odds and markets for baseball, the NBA, NHL, PGA Tour, and so much more. Awesome new and existing user promotions. America's number one sports book. Very easy to use, safe and secure. You get your winnings fast. I cannot recommend it enough. Love gambling with FanDuel. If you are a new just download the fan Duel sports Book app to get started now. Signed up with promo code Colin so they know we sent you. What is going on everybody, John Middlecoff Three and Out Podcast. I had a podcast already ready for you, and you'll still hear all of it. I talked with Cam Hayward, Pittsburgh Steeler, pro bowler, All Pro and just incredible human being I had. Obviously, if you listen to Andrew Whitworth, who's the reigning Man of the Year, I would put Cam Hayward in that category. I mean, he's been up for the award with the Steelers. I think he'll eventually win. When I think high level NFL guys, you know non quarterbacks, the whit worst, the Calais Campbell's guys that have won that award. He's that He's an impressive dude. He really is. I'm a huge fan, not that I wasn't before, but I'm gonna follow you. Pittsburgh Steeler fans know how lucky you've been to have the guy complete stud But there was some breaking news, so I wanted to get a couple of takes out before we dive into the interview. Subscribe through the podcast Three and Out fire that if you listen through Collins Feed subscribed separately to my feed, the three and Out podcast would greatly appreciate it. Share with your friends, share with your enemies, check out the volume on YouTube. Uh. Anything else is going on obviously, Middlecoff mail back at John Middlecoff. I want you to slide into the d m s and get your question answered. Middlecoff mail back. Football season, We're here, the Raiders are on the field, all the teams By the next time you hear me, the next podcast will probably be on Tuesday. Uh, and then we'll kind of get back into the flow of things with football and still still sprinkle it some golf. We gotta Live Live. You know Greg Norman, He's Greg Norman's ruffles. Some feathers. Don't sleep on, uh, don't sleep on the shark. Florio is like, what if the Saudis take on the NFL. It ain't happening, buddy. It's a little more expensive to take on. Not that they don't have the money, but they don't. It's not possible. Everyone's getting rich in the league, you know, including Florio covers the league that the NFL is a cash cow. Golf was was there and right for the taking. Uh So, Yeah, before I get into Russell uh not Russell Wilson, Kyler Murray, I wanted to say something just you know. I I think about it a lot, and I think it's so cool the way it's all played out that I get to be partners and work with the volume and for the volume and have this podcast. And for those of you that hadn't heard I have this podcast. Colin Coward texted me, I think in two thousand eighteen with the idea of doing a podcast before you even had a network. And I started the Three Out podcast in eighteen and nineteen before the volume ever existed. And when I think great, and I'm saying this because the volume now has Richard Sherman. Obviously, the success of Draymond Green and his podcast and his you Google Draymond Green on YouTube and the YouTube numbers he did for the volume, the overwhelming majority of CBS, ABC, NBC, the shows they have don't sniff those numbers. And when I think about Colin, to me, he's on the mount Rushmore of sports talk radio people in the history of radio, right, I mean, the two biggest cash cows in the history of radio are Howard Sterton and Rush Limball. Those are the two guys that set the tone in the biggest cash cows in the history of radio and sports talk. To me, they're like four guys that really stand out. There is Jim Rome, There is Dan Patrick. I put Mike and the Mad Dog together, and I put Colin, and I think Colin is kind of separated from that crew. Like Dan Patrick created as Dan Patrick Show, left ESPN and created his own show and it was entrepreneurs really successful. But it's just him, Mike and the Magdog. Right, even when they split up, Mike had his own radio show, Mad Dog Got Paid Went to Serious, Right, was the like their version of Howard stern but obviously way smaller. But for sports. Jim Rome incredible businessman, made a ton office show, but really just made money for himself. Colin like those guys, super successful, super rich yet ire vividly remember being in the car driving home in the middle of two thousand twenty. My brother calls me and goes, hey, bro, uh, look at the prices right now to play Pebble, Beach, spy Glass. All these courses in Monterey they are like half off this like Pete Covid because those places, Pebble they usually charged you know, four or five six dollars. Pebble charges like six, but spy Glass charges like three fifty four. But there they get a lot of international travel. Well in two twenty no one could internationally travel, so we have to play. I think we played spy Glass like a hundred and fifty dollars. It was sweet. It was awesome. And we're driving back and Colin calls me and he's like, I'm thinking of this idea. I've been looking into it, and a little inside the volume, he's like, I was talking to Erica Nardini, who I think he's actually had on his podcast a year ago, who is the CEO of bar Stool and Talking the Business a podcast, and I could just tell like he was fired up, he was inspired, he realized what it had and he wasn't. It was one thing to talk and then he's lived it. And again, like those other guys, he's already a multimillionaire. He's already super successful. He doesn't have to do any of this. Those guys are not doing any of this. Why they don't have to most people, especially once you get fifty sixty sixty five years old, and you accomplish law in your career, that's kind of the time when you would joy your family, start traveling. Not saying he doesn't, but he has this idea, then he executes it and then it's shooting like a fucking rocket ship. And now back to back. His two player podcasts are Draymond Green and Richard Sherman. These are two guys and it just shows you, like what I listen, I don't consider myself media. I know Draymond talks about new media. I'm just a guy who tries to speak for other people because I when I watch a lot of the media, I have nothing in common with any of them. So I just tried to speak for us to watch games on our couch that like to have a good time over the weekend, play a little golf, hang out with our significant others or family, and just kind of chill. Like I tried to speak for us, we're the majority. You know, Without us, there is no pro sports. Uh, the media kind of gets lost and convoluted. So I try to fill that role. But Draymond and Richard every T n T s already signing Draymond for when Charles Goes to Live and Richard Sherman has like these guys were sought after entities by traditional media, yet they realize, like I can do way more in this, and so did Colin two or three years ago. Now obviously other people did too, Built Emmons, bar Stool, these guys were ahead of the curve. But like those guys had a lot to prove, Like what's Colin trying to prove now? Just an incredible, incredible entrepreneurial spirit for a guy that doesn't need to have it. And I feel very, very lucky to be a part of this. And it's just really cool when you see that, Like, how are you gonna top Draymond? Am I saying Richard's gonna top Draymond, but you get Sure, you get Richard Sherman, so you're you're two big playerbod guests are Draymond Green and Richard Sherman. Like it's just incredible tip of my hat. I found out what everyone else did on on social media, and I was just like, damn, that's that's pretty badass. And I've you know, got to know Sure a little bit through d M and over the years, especially when he played for the forty Niners and um, big big fan, uh, total stud and just as a football player that there's no human beings I respect more in the sport of football cornerbacks that will tackle. And I think in my adult life the last couple of decades, I think Richard Sherman is the best tackling cornerback. And potentially, you know, if you're listening to this and you're older than me, I mean, some of those guys in like the seventies and eighties, some of the corners were probably, but I think he's one of the best of the model of the salary cap era. I think you could say that Richard Sherman might be the best tackling corner and obviously it's a great corner in his prime, several time All Pro Pro Bowl. I think he's a Hall of Famer, but tackling and ultimately that speaks to one of the toughest motherfucker's to ever play the position, especially in the modern era. Uh, big big Sherman fan, and uh pretty cool for the big, big moment for the volume. Let's be real, Draymond Green that now Richard Sherman thing, he's going pretty well, you know, traditional you know, they've gotta be a little ratuls you know. Also there's a timing element, like it's not all like I didn't create any of this. Colin liked me for whatever reason. It's worked out well. Traditional radios dying and this has taken off. So uh, it's pretty cool to be a part of this. I have a couple of quick takeaways before we get into the Camp Heyward interview on on Kyler Murray. First and foremost, I think the best businesses and listen, there's always a time to be aggressive. The best people in most industries are aggressive, but there's a timing to that aggression. You can't just be aggressive NonStop, right There is a time and a place and through experience, you know, when to put the pedal of the metal, get in the fast lane, and sometimes to chill. I think this two thousand twenty one was a good example from a stock market perspective. Everyone was investing and people made some money, but a lot of people weren't selling towards the peak. Right, They're investing more, investing more, and then it gets cut in half and a lot of people have lost the shipload of money. And not everyone can afford to just sit on their losses. Like some people that really really hurts, and some people that have been in a long time went like, once I double or triple my money, pigs get fed, hogs get slaughtered. I get out, I said on the sideline the moment everyone's talking about it, that's where I back off. And I saw Colin today and I agree with them that where are you going to find another Kyler Murray? And like Holmes, things always go up. Now I would disagree there because I was gonna buy a home last year and I was like, you know, I just I have a hard time. Something that was eight hundred thousand dollars a year ago is now one point six million dollars. This doesn't end up. I'm listening. Could that house be worth three million dollars in two years? Sure, but I would historically if you just look at trends, that's not usually the way it works. And I've been proven right the last six months. Things are coming back to earth, especially in the markets. I'm looking at halted going down, and that's not the case necessarily. Quarterbacks. Contracts always go up, but you don't have to buy. You don't always have to pay for something, especially in a football situation. When a guy is under contract. What was the rush in paying him today? And at the time of recording this, the number we see a hundred and sixty million dollars. Now a lot of that's gonna be how much new money the fourth year contract, the fourth year of his contract, the fifth year, which I don't even know what that number is probably well over thirty million dollars that is going to be factored in. Who knows, maybe they'll even factor in the franchise tag. But I just don't understand why we couldn't play this out another year, Like why did I have to do this right now? Because based on the evidence I have, I go, you've been a very talented player. I have never argued that his arm strength, he's pretty accurate, he's mobile, he has a fantastic talent, little but a fantastic talent, and when he's on, he's exceptional. But I threw this out there on Twitter, and I have a philosophy when I'm gonna pay a premium and even if the number, let's say, if you're listening to this and the true numbers eighty million guaranteed, this still stands. Whether they gave a hundred million dollars guaranteed or whether it's actually a hundred and sixty million dollars. It's a ton of money, and it's you are committing to him for several more years than you have to. I would. My philosophical belief in prose sports is I want to pay premiums for guys that can handle and thrive and rise to the occasion when ship hits the fan, when things go wrong, Because most guys at the highest level can play really good in all the sports when things are going well. When you're on you know, a seven game winning streak in baseball and you have five home runs over that period of time. When you're in basketball and your team's won ten straight games, your averaging points and everyone's feeling you. When you're a quarterback and you guys go on a four game win streak and over those four games you throw fifteen touchdowns, you run for a couple more, you're the player of the month. Everyone's on their knees gargling. It's like, oh yeah, how about when you lose three games and your star right tackle tears a c l and everyone, because you're the star, says you're playing like shit, how's it going? What are you gonna do? How are you gonna carry this team? Do you do you thrise the occasion? Do do you crumble like a cookie? Do do you melt like ice? Under of the hundred degrees? Son? And I think we've seen and I have a good I've had a front row seat for the forty niners, and last year Ship was hitting the fan. It was weird. Guys were injured, and I watched guys like Nick Bosa and Deebo Samuel become absolute war daddies and play their best football when Ship was not going well, win or loose, not They weren't winning all the games, but just laying it on the line, never pounding, never complaining. And you see it with countless players all around the league that just keep throwing haymakers. I think a great example is Matt Stafford, who last year had a longer body of work than Kyler Murray, but because of a situation, we went, well, how good is he plays for Detroit? Can you win with him? Does he have a bunch of bad habits? We know he's talented, physical freak number one overall. Pick what's he got? How's he gonna handle the pressure? And it was up and down, it was if you want he had that stretcher. He was throwing all those picks. He was turning the ball overs, but clearly internally and Wentworth hit on this. He never flinched. He handled himself like a pro. He answered the bell every single time. And then once they lost that week a team game to the forty niners, he had an elite stretch in the playoffs and was awesome. So he handled the Rockies tide pretty well. He's out there. It was like, God, is Matt Stafford gonna screw this thing up? Or they're not gonna win the division? What's going on? They end up winning the division? A ton of pressure. How's Matt Stafford gonna for the first time ever, not just making the playoffs school, you gotta win playoff games. We traded for you to try to win the super Bowl. And then he's awesome and they win the super Bowl. It's like, I give him an extension to longer body of work. I've seen him when the lights are the brightest, handle himself like a pro, handle adversity and then answered the bell and execute. Because ultimately, I saw Mike Tomlin say this on UH say this on the Pivot podcast, was like, the business is winning. That's the business we're in. The sport is football, but the business is winning. That's the name of the game here. And we saw Kyler Murray have the most embarrassing playoff game we've ever seen, and then immediately he demanded to get paid. And he's not the first and he won't be the last guy to demand to get paid. Some guys, though, Dak Prescott, for example, and I've saw a lot of this on social media that Dak Prescott's contract has aged better. Bullshit. I don't like paying Dak Prescott forty million dollars, but Dak Prescott the human being when times are great, when times are bad, he's very very even keel. I know exactly what I'm getting. He's not gonna pout, He'll give everything he has. He has physical limitations, he does not have the arm Kyler has, but I know that will lay it on the line for me. No one will ever go did Dak mail that ship in? No one will ever say that, because we have a long body of evidence that he's never done that. Getting back to back years, people the season ended went like, was what was Kyler's deal there? What was no one's ever argued his arm, strength, his speed, his physical attributes, not a soul. But there's more than that at quarterback? What what's cowards thing? Being Quarterbackio? It's like presidential which I even think like being a politician, Like if you don't think at this point in time they're all kind of frauds, I can't help you. I still think it matters, Like I don't think it matters as a politician. I think it's all bullshit. It matters at quarterback how you act, how you conduct yourself, because all the best guys kind of conduct themselves like pros. And let's use an example Aaron Rodgers. Last year, things got a little weird him and Gouda Kins. He demanded to trade on draft night. You're like, God, Rodgers falling off the deep end. Well, what happened? Training camp came and part of people are like, he just wants to get paid. He didn't get a contract extension, tabled it right, acted like a pro answer. The bell won the m v P, and his body of work was long. We already know how future Hall of Famer like. It felt like Kyler Murray NBA style force their hand and they capitulated and they gave in. Now you could argue, well, they're all in on Cliff Kingsbury, you might as well be all in on Kyler. I just think that is not the way to run a franchise, and I'm shorten them. I do not think they're gonna make the payoffs this year. Uh. You can say, well, they just get him in a better headspace. That's fine. I don't think he's a sustainable player, and maybe I would have been proven wrong. But if I was the Cardinals, I would have let it play out. He's not Dak Prescott played a season on the franchise tag, and I'm not even saying to get there with Kyler. How about just seeing another season of you acting like a pro of you improving as a leader, of you leading us to the playoffs, of you maybe trying in a playoff game. I don't know, but that's not the way the Cardinals handled their business. And you would say historically under the Bidwell family umbrella, that's why the Cardinals have mostly been pretty shitty. Now, I'm not acting like they are a joke franchise. I think Steve kind they have a lot of talent on their team. They're not. I don't view them as some like loser franchise. But that's I thought kind of a loser move. I thought it was an unneeded move. What what's well, he would come to he's not gonna show up, Well, then you'd learn everything you need to know. He's gonna show up to training camp and pout, Well, then you're gonna learn anything you need to know. That's not the type of guy you want, because what do they tell you that your true colors and who you really are are actually usually exposed with money Once I pay you, the true self comes out. I would be a little nervous if everyone involved with the Arizona Cardinals and I just again, I get back to over and over what was the rush. I'm not disputing. If you won the m v P this year, it goes up a little bit. Who cares at least then you know? At least then you know when the chief game mahomes all that money he had won the m v P and he let him do a super Bowl that had happened. When Matt Stafford just got a huge extension, they want to sup both him as their quarterback. When Aaron Rodgers got a hundred fifty million dollars, he was back to back m v P gets along with the coach. This guy just got up again. I don't truly know the money. Time will tell when you're listening to this have the worst playoff game we've ever seen, and was pretty terrible down the stretch. And the previous year when they look like a lot to make the playoffs, they missed the playoffs. And here's the other element from just a true football standpoint, he's small, and being small doesn't dictate your success or not. We've seen small players go to the Hall of Fame be great players. Russell Wilson is a great example. Hall of Fame level quarterback. Russell Wilson has built completely different Now we can argue he's gotta get a little big this offseason. But Russell's naturally thick and he's been healthy. The first time that Matt finger whatever was the first injury. God, there's a chicken Russell's armor. Right, He's injured and he missed a couple of games. Kailer now has been hurt back to back seasons. Two years ago was the Seattle game he got slammed. Never the same last year he got banged up, miss some games, right, Colt McCoy came in. They actually split up the Niners. But like he's been hurt now, well, it's not that crazy. He's a small little player. So you're going all in and listen, you do when you draft a guy number one overall, but part of drafting them in the first round is having the fifth year option and having some time. Mine and the Cardinals just felt like, what Kyler is gonna show up and be very angry and be mad and pouty. Wouldn't that be a reflection of who this guy is like? Wouldn't that kind of show his true colors? Then? Why wouldn't you just let it play out a little bit? Hell, maybe even let it play out into the season, be like, listen, you start fast, you're having a good season, will extend you in the middle of October. You had to do it July one. I just I don't understand it. I mean again, and I I root for people to get paid. I don't care, like it doesn't matter to me. Kyler, Murray, contrac whatever. Get as much money as you can. But we're talking the business of football, where there's a salary cap and how much you get paid impacts the success of your team. And in football, we teams matter. They're the health of the league. And some teams run their business well. Some teams do not. And we have a couple of years ago, the Rams are kind of feeling themselves. They extended two guys really early and heavily backfired Todd Gurley Jared Goff. Now I'm not comparing Kyler to Jared Goff. He's much more talented. Now, I'm not comparing. Obviously Todd plays a different position. But immediately we realized those were bad contracts, and I just I had this whole situation red flagged. Um. I just I don't think it's sustainable. I don't think he's a sustainable player. I could be proven wrong. If I was the Arizona Cardinals, I would have let him prove me wrong. Let's dive into cam Heyward big news. Fan Duel has an all new mobile gaming app. Fan Duel face Off is where you compete quick fun games against other real people for real cash. Has all sorts of games you're familiar with, like a home run, Derby, Wheel of Fortune, puzzle strategy games and more. Contests are action packed last between two and five minutes. You can plan your couch waiting in line during a commercial break whenever on your schedule. Practice for free anytime that's cool, whether it's had to head, multiplayer, large turn, it's fan Duel face Off something for you. Plus, in most games you're gonna be matched against peeps of similar skill levels. You're not totally overmatched even as a beginner. Face Off also tied to your FanDuel account and wallet, so you can easily use your daily fantasy funds or sports books winnings in the apps. Please download the FanDuel Face Off app and compete in a few non cash contests fandel dot com. Always use the code colin download the FanDuel face Off app. Getting the game from Cringing at the pump to getting an eye opening check at your favorite restaurant. Inflation is hitting us all. Trust me, I know, and it really hurts. That's why I started using Upside. Upside is an incredible app for anyone who buys gas, groceries, or dines out. With every purchase, I'm earning hashback thanks to Upside. It's really easy. You just download the app, go to your app store, download the Upside app, and when you go get gas where I live in California, it's the most expensive in the country. You upload your receipt or check in on the app. Very easy to do, and then you earn cash back every time you use it. I can't recommend it enough, especially during these inflationary times. This app was made for two two So once you claim an offer for whatever you're buying on Upside, check in at the business page usual with a credit card, and you get paid with real cash. Download the free Upside app and use the promo code three and out to get five dollars or more cash back on your first purchase of ten or more dollars. That's five dollars or more cash back on your first purchase of ten or more using the promo code number three and d out. That's promo code three and out. It's my pleasure to uh to bring on all pro. You know, I would say defensive tackle, but I'll say defensive lineman. Several time pro bowler. I don't think he's ever. He doesn't know what losing is. He's only played for Ohio Satan and Pittsburgh's entire career. Cam, Heyward, what's going on? Bro? What's up? Appreciate you having me. Thank you for the introduction as well. No problem, man, how's uh? How summer going with? What the hell you been up to? Uh? Trying to do a podcast? Uh? You know we used the same producer and James is always cracking down him and giving me hell uh. And then just try and take care of kids and um, trying to get better in my craft. You know, those are the three things going on, and man, they take up a lot of my day. How many kids you have got? Three? Six and two? My oldest is a boy? You're you are a man on the move. Well, I saw you talking to Mac Coffee about diet and obviously you know, Hell, I'm smaller than you, but once you get I'm a couple of years older than you. Once you hit a certain age, you know, diet, you know it's very very impactful, right and uh, the off season for a guy like you with working out, how how do you balance working out in food and stay in focus when basically you get forty days off till the season starts. Man, Um, your diet is everything, especially right before the season and during the season. Um, you know, you really care about what's going in your body. I feel like the only time they really cheat on food is you know, right at the end of the off season where I'm just like, you know, depressed and um, piste off. We didn't go further in the season, but you know now it's just, um, you care about what you eat, and um, I just gotta take care of your body. I don't like to do these fad diets, but man, you just try to continue to just put good things in your body, have good protein, and uh, stay basically boring with your meals. Well, it's one thing like if you're just a single dude, you know, in your twenties eating healthy, get you know, you have kids, so I'm sure you've got crap all over the place. You're always taking them by McDonald's or whatever. Like is that? I mean, it would be a test on any man. Bro Well, Like I like look back at like as a kid, and I'm like, like I had playing McDonald's growing up. Like my wife does a great job. She won't even let them get McDonald's anymore. And I'm like, I have to have like meals prepared because if I get anywhere close to their food I'm just gonna dive right into the pantry and you know, go ham. But um my wife's always like, why don't you just eat our food? I'm like, because that's a little bit more unhealthy and I need to, you know, watch what I eat before I blow up. As an older guy, I mean, you're a veteran now in the league. Do you for your training, especially lifting, because I mean you do work in the trenches, you lift as hard as you once did. Is it a lot different? Is it more just maintaining year round or do you go heavy and then once the season hits to you you sustaining, Like how does that work? As you've aged? You know, it's crazy. Um as I was when I was younger, I used to always go to these fancy places and you know, have like everything catered to you where it was. You know, this is what they specialized. Um. I think in the last four years I found a trainer who does an amazing job here. Used to train Paul Plauz, Lusnie and Sean Lee. Um, and he's trained a lot of other guys. But um, everything is just what I need at the time, you know. You know, the great thing about me is I haven't been injured a lot, so I've been able to keep you know, pushing my limits get stronger. Um. But there are times I need to you know, scale back and uh determine what my body's needs, and I've been able to. You know, the Steelers have allowed me to just keep up that during the season with my trainer, and it's just benefited me. Um. Obviously I like to work out with you know, the guys in the facility, but my trainer has done a great job of, you know, making sure I was able to continue to keep keep getting better. And if I'm hurt, we address that and make sure that it doesn't become an issue once the season ends. You know, you talk about a football guy. I mean you come from a football family. Your dad played in the league and your brother. I didn't even realize this was just drafted by the Steelers. UM, Michigan State. Uh. Color that we'll get into that. That's pretty cool. When the season end, you guys get you know, losing the first round of the playoffs. How much time do you just get away from football? Oh? Well, I wanted to get away right after that game, but I had the Pro Bowl coming up. Um, And so we went from Pro Bowl and then I had some stuff to do with Super Bowl. UM. And surprisingly right after that, UM, I couldn't really disappear from working out. I feel like I got right back into it right to the season. UM. You know, just trying to continue to craft craft and get better. UM. Usually in the past, I've took him about a month off. I'm just trying to disappear with the family for a little bit. UM. But man, I've been. I feel like I haven't stopped and hopefully, Uh that's a good thing. What's funny is for the Steelers going into the draft, just because the talk of the drafting a quarterback really high and at the time, I'm sure you, just like all of us, unless Tomlin Colbert were giving you the good inside information. It's like Malik Willis, Malik Willis Malik willis talking quarterback and you guys end up taking a quarterback and when the draft ends, I mean a lot of people are talking about that, but for you personally, your brother gets drafted on the team, Like, I mean, how cool? How cool was that moment? Oh? If I could go through that moment, that moment was insane because uh, what was the day three? So the first two days we knew he was gonna drafting first day, the second day is second and third, and we thought, okay, maybe third he might have a chance. UM, and then I'm talking about either he was like, you know, day three's are sweet spot. You know Day three, um, fourth and fifth round and you just never know. UM. And so he's getting calls from different teams and you know, he's like, I don't know if they're interested or they're interested in me being an undrafted rookie, and then they, you know, call and sign me. So he's going through that and I can just watch him. He's like like the competitor inside my brother. He was so like ticked off that, like he's watching guys and it's like I'm better than him, and I know I'm better than him. I'm like, you can't do that. You just gotta focus. You gotta understand that, like you know, team see other things differently. Wherever you end up, that's where you make your mark um. And then you know he like stormed off one time, and this time, like my mom's or my brothers are like, go check on him, just to make sure he's okay. And then I go in the room and the phone rings and I don't know who it is and I look at the screen and it has the Bears up and it says it picks in and I'm like, oh, he's going to the Bears. That's really cool. And then he gives me this like sort of like little smirk where it's like like you don't need to know who's I met to enter this call. And I'm like, is it Chicago? He's like, no, it wasn't Chicago. And I'm like, who was it? And he I was like, and I asked him who was it? He just walks away and he says hold on and then he goes into the family room and you know, he has us all waiting, and I'm like, okay, and then I see, oh, Pittsburgh's nest and I'm like he would have told me by then if you got drafted to my team. And then I had to watch it come across the clicker and I'm like, this, dude, he could have just literally told me. And then my T called me and you know, told me. He was like, we got him. He was like, I didn't think he was gonna be there in the sixth round. Uh, but we got him. And I was like, my T, I appreciate this, um, but I'm not gonna let you down. Like you know, this is my little brother. I'm gonna make sure you know he lives up to everything. And he was like, oh, I already knew he was gonna do that, so you know, I'm drafting because you know of the player he is not because he's your brother. And I'm like, okay, So it's been surreal. And like my mom had already disappeared from that moment because she was already so nervous, so like she was outside the house and like when she came back, we were all celebrated. She was like, where's he going and we were like, he's coming to Pittsburgh and she broke out in tears right there. So you know, we were very fortunate. Um, it doesn't really end up that way most of the time. But uh, it's crazy to think about had they whether it be an assistant coach, coach Tomlin Colbert, any of his people, had they brought him up to you leading up to the draft when you just had the facility working out or any of that. So like, they never brought him up specifically, like leading up to the draft. It was always like, um, they would watch, the scouts would watch, and I would watch individually during the season and he said, did you watch Connor? You know? Um, and we would always exchange like what we thought, you know what he was good at, what was at But they kept me out of loot for a lot of it, And I was like, I like it that way because I don't want to have a say on anything. I know the scouts there do an amazing job. So um they did right this time. Yeah, I'd say, you're part of the team is pretty good at drafting. Uh. You know what's funny is I was a graduate assistant Fresno State. Would have been probably when you were playing at in Ohio State, and uh, I don't know if he specifically did the West coast, but me and Joe Green would come. I think he scouted a lot of colleges and he came five both years. And I remember one year he lost his own and it was lost, and I just remember it was my job to find me and Joe Green's phone, and I ended up finding it and he shook my hand. I'm sure you got big hands. This guy has to have the biggest hands I've ever shook in my entire life. Yes, yes, I remember when I got drafted and I went in and me and Joe was there, and he literally engulfed my hand and I was like, oh, I've never felt like this, like intimidated off the field before in my life. And so you know, me and me and Joe and knowing who me and Joe is before then, um, it was he was one of my heroes. You know, he's a hero in Pittsburgh. And getting the meet um for the first time in person, UM, welcome me to be a Steeler. Um. I was excited. But man, when you see his hands, they just they're humongous. They take up like if they were on the screen, they take up the entire screen. It's it's it's wild. Back your brother for a second, because you guys, obviously there's a big ga in age, So it's not like, you know, one was a sophomore and one was a senior, you would have played together. You know, even the boast of brothers are somewhat closer in age had to be a little surreal. Just I know, you guys haven't, like the pads haven't come on. But just being in the same locker room as him, seeing him walk around and put on a Pittsburgh Steeler jersey, I mean that's pretty crazy. It's really weird because like he's been in our locker room multiple times just as a guest of mine, um, and like I've given him, like you know, Steeler crap before, but like now he has his own Steeler stuff. Like he's able to go out through the field and not just stay on the sideline. And you know, I have to there's certain times where I'm like, I cannot just be his brother. I have to be his teammate. And uh, usually I talk a lot of crap to my teammates. I talk, I'll talk a lot more when you're my brother, and I make sure I make sure you know that, like you got a lot to live up to, so you better I let me down or my dad down. So you know, he knows that and he'll be better because of it. You know, it's funny. I'm in the Bay Area right now and about probably fifteen mini fifteen minutes away from me is Antioch. We're Naji grew up and played high school football, and it's we'll get into college recruiting a little bit later, because you know, you went from you know, played for high school football in Georgia, but ended up at Ohio State, which I don't know if Georgia would let you out of the state nowadays, you know, they curb all over you. But not the same thing with you know, Naji. When I was in college, Pete Carroll never would have let him get out of the state. He would have been at USC, but he ends up in Alabama. Comes to you, guys. I was watching uh Tomlin talk with Ryan Clark on his podcast with those guys, and he talked about the Christmas tree story. How Naji, you know, just didn't have anything, and he kind of went to you obviously, as you know, the team leader, the captain, the guy that runs the show, and you got him a Christmas tree. But it was really one thing he talked about this offseason and just moving forward is your ability to kind of like teach him the way to be the leader of the squad one day, because ultimately, you know, obviously he's a fantastic player, but just in terms of the person, your interactions with him, one, what what you thought about him when you first met him, and just kind of the time you've spent with him since trying to give him the Pittsburgh Steeler away. Yeah, you know, I think Naji is one of the more ultimate football people because he just loves football, like he wants to be great at it. And you see the way he competes and it's a it's a gift and the curse, like he wants to be a part of everything. But Naji can't do everything. And you know, we've always been hard on Naji because he's arting himself because the sky's limit. Like I think one day he's going to be the top running back in this league. Um. And you know he can shoulder a team and offense. Um. And we just have lofty goal for him, like when he first got here. Um, you know, everybody likes to talk about, you know, his big legs, but man, the dudes a workhorse, like he comes to practice, wants to practice, wants to get better. Um, and that's I think that comes from like the Alabama side. Um. But he's also a big kid as well, and so we uh, we got to talk and then, UM, you understand that you know, Nazi has got some growing to do, but the way he goes about his business and just wants to get better, You're like, all right, you see where he could you know, potentially leave one day. Um. And I think Naji only understands football because you know that's a safe haven. And the point of me getting the Christmas tree was you gotta be a human as well. You gotta you know, you can't just think football, football, football and not you know, live because things will pass you by and you won't be able to enjoy, you know, the fruits of your labor. Um. I think for me, I just wanted to give him a Christmas tree to just let him open up, let them know that it's Christmas, enjoy the time with your family. Um. And I didn't know if you ever had in a Christmas tree before, so I wanted to make sure I did that. Um. Going forward, as as a leader of this team, I feel like Naji has got to be the guy on offense. Um, you know, they're gonna be given the rock a lot more and a lot of a lot more often. So he's got to be willing to not only let his play uh speak, but he's got to speak as well. Um. Because you've had Ben Roethlisberger so long, this is a great opportunity for Naji Harris to be the catalyst for everybody on offense. Um. There's so many moving a parts, so many new positions we have, but Naji should be the staple. Naji should be the guy that uh, you know coach t R refers to as the straw that stirs to drink and Naji Naji's gott be that way on offense. Did practice feel different this spring without Roethlisberg. Uh, practice didn't feel different. I just think, you know, we've gotten so used to having been back there and uh kinning around and like Ben, could you know, uh do some things that were different where we'll let him extend to play. Um, but we're not letting these rookies extend plays because they're not Ben Roethlisberger. Uh in new guys. But um, it thought a little different, but not much. How do you balance as one of the lead dugs on the squad of you know, obviously you have you know, you signed Trabisky, but then you also draft a quarterback high. I mean that position is it's hard, right because only one guy gets to play on like d line mean or wide receivers where everyone gets to rotate. And he's kind of got to be the leader. But you know who totally knows. We'll see what plays out in training camp of just kind of you just embrace them both, or isn't one of those things you just kind of let it play? How do you attack that personally? All the above, I think you embrace them both, or embrace everybody. Um, But I think you go in saying this is Mr bisically spot to lose. Um, he should be given the reins. Um he's had success. You know, everybody likes to talk about what Mitch did wrong, but he took the Chicago Bears to the playoffs. UM. And you know, I think he's got a better surrounding cast. I think, um, we can help you know him so he doesn't have to drive the whole field. UM. And then from Kenny and Mason's point of view, UM, they should be vying for that spot. This is the perfect opportunity for that. Um, you know, competition breeds uh success, and I think everybody's gonna be vying for the spot. If the guy behind me is not trying to vide for my spot, um, shame on him. But all three guys, Um, Kenny, Mason, and Mitch should be vying for the number one spot. You know they're my team mates. But man, we're going to compete to make sure we have the best group out there. Uh. That starts September. One of my worst takes of all time was when Roethlisberger tears his arm baseball style gets Tommy John You guys make the trade for Manca Fitzpatrick's first round pick. I'm like, this is insane. You know you guys, you guys can be drafting the top five. Mika is a good player, but what are you doing? Not only does me get there, he be he was already good, but he was incredible once he got there. You guys don't lose because you never lose, and you were it's not that big a deal when that trade happened. What was your first what was your thought? And then once you started playing with them, how fast did you realize? Like, holy ship, this guy is good. Oh well, like I've um talked to Kevin Colber about this many times. Um. When he did that trade for Manca, Uh, it's solidified that we weren't throwing away the season. Um. And we were in that game in San Francisco the week make a tame Minco didn't even know the entire playbook. But when Minka got out there, I think he caused the fumble, uh, and then had an interception and was just making plays. And I went to Kevin in the middle of that game, I was like, I appreciate you doing that. We needed that. Um. But you know, I think when you have a guy like Manka, man, he gives you an opportunity. And um, we have a lot of good players and we know we knew Ben was hurt and now for the season, but man, we were not ready to throw away the season. UM. And you know that it just lets it kind of gave us that confidence like we don't care who's that quarterback, we still compete. It's funny how a guy can go from being someone's brother, like your brother is gonna be Cam's brother until he, you know, has a nine touchdown season, then all of a sudden he becomes his own guy. Well, it's like j. J. Watt one of the best players in the league. His brothers come into the league. At first t J Watt again, it's just a J brother and then that quickly changes, like, no, he's just t J. Watt now. But last year. You know one thing that used to happen. It probably happened a little bit when you first came into league. It happened a lot like when your dad was playing in the eighties and nineties and probably the early two thousands up to like Revus days where the holdouts. Now this new thing is to hold in and you're you know, people practice in high school, college and the NFL doesn't change that much in terms of individual group. So you're spending time with your defensive lineman and t J just standing there. Obviously it's the elephant in the room. He's probably he's not going anywhere, But was there? What was that like? The hold in? Just see just standing there looking at you guys when you're taking all the reps. Well, I'll say this, as much as it was a hold in, t J did a great job of being professional about it. Um, you know, he let everything takes its course. But they didn't stop stop him from training. Um. It may have looked like he was standing on the sideline, but the dude was doing passionates drills by himself of running on the sideline, making sure he was in good shape because he didn't want it to be detrimental to the team. UM and I commend him like for that. Uh. These hold ends are different um per the c b A. Uh. It prevents guys from holding out because now you get fine and you can't get that money back. Um, but a hold in it shows that you want to be there. You're taking part of meetings. But I have to be smart about my future and what's going on. Uh. And I think I think it's a good responsible way to approach the situations. Now, the TJ really barge into to the Rooney's office and uh, you do the deal himself at the end of that A story that took on a life of its own. I don't know. Uh, I don't know if he barged in. Uh. You know, I know he probably had the clear with us Mr Rooney secretary or something, but I don't I don't know. Um, it might have taken on a different story, but uh, man, it will be revered as one of those legends that happened where it was like the deal done, let's get a sign. But uh, you know, I think we were all happy for him to get done because, um, you know t J has earned it, Um, Minka has earned it. Uh, and we understand the players they are uh, and this was just um validating that because we've seen what they've done weekend and week out. Uh, they need to be paid like they're the top of their positions. I think my favorite Steeler story over the last decade, it's funnier now that it probably wasn't the time, was you guys are playing a preseason game and there was a team plane and there were a couple of running backs headed to the team plane and they might live where I live. It's legal, you know, going back and forth. I think the NFL doesn't even test for it anymore. And one of them didn't make the team plane. The other guy ends up on the team plane is le Garrett and Levian. You might have been a little marijuana going back and forth, did you remember that? And only one of them showed up, and that it was that just like everyone talking on the plane is you're going, well, you know, We've always been told, um, you know, if you don't make the team playing, you will get left. And I have anxiety. Yeah, and so I've always made sure I'm like at least thirty minutes early, uh, because I just I don't want to be that guy. Uh. And you know, we're getting closer to time and we're like where our players. Um, you know, le Garrett shows up, uh, not dressed in a white T and we're like, bro, get your get your stuff on. Uh. And then we were like, where's the Lebyan And then it just took on a different meeting. We were like, you're not just late, you're dealing with something else, and uh, Lebian got a fight later that night and we saw him at the team meeting and we were like, oh damn, that's gonna be it's gonna be healty fine because Mike t doesn't play about missing. But we left it at that and we just focused what's it. Obviously, I think Tomlins, I think it's safe to say, you know, he's obviously well respected by fans and he's just an incredible quote. Uh. I mean last year when the USC and he dropped the never say never, but never is a it's an all timer, but that I think as the Antonio and Levi on some of those things, He's like status has even growing. Like I think on the outside we respected more. It's like this guy can handle anything. What's it like? I mean, you've been around him now for over a decade. Obviously you guys are it's safe to say as your coach, but you guys are pretty close personally. Uh what what's what's it like being Mike Tomlin's friend and his player? Um, it's it's it's crazy. Um, Like I always revere a coach t before I even got here, and I was like, man, I'd love to play for him. And now that I do, UM, it means that much more to me. Uh. I'd run through a brick wall for him. Um. He's got a super Bowl, but I want to be able to hand him that trophy as well. Um. He is. He has pushed me, he has made me a better player. UM. And the thing I love about it is he always tells us, Um, I'm gonna treat you fairly, but not equally. UM. And you know he's gonna give everybody the benefit of doubt. But other people need different things than other people. Other players and so what player fifty three on the roster might need something different than player one on the roster. UM, And I think he's able to have those individual relationships with people to figure out when everybody needs. Um, he knows how to push my buttons and he's pushed my buttons UM a lot, and I appreciate over the time. Uh, but you know it's only made me better. And UM, I can't speak enough to the man he is. Um the single mild mild mindedness and tunnel vision he shows during the season and allows us to just go out there and understand that football is our job and this is what we need to take care of. Um. He provides ownership and accountability to the group. And you know, with that that creates honesty and creates a lot of transparency that if it's not handled the right way, Uh, your team will crumble and will falter because nothing things weren't focused on properly, and things slipped through the cracks. Well, what's the thing? The standard is the standard, right And you guys, just I mean you there's an element of luck. I mean you've never lost. I mean obviously when you go to OHI State, you're not gonna lose much. But coming to the NFL, you have a lot of Ohio State teammates and guys that have played on the State of the last twenty years ago to crappy teams, and it's not their fault, you know, you just you just you guys just don't lose it ever, you know, and when it's the worst. And I always judge people on their lowest moments. That's why I give Belichick a lot of credit. A couple of years ago when the twenty season and Tom left, everyone acted like they were one. They did go seven and nine. Now that's under five dred. But a lot of teams if they're worst year seven and nine, it's not the biggest deal. You guys worst years or eight and eight or better. And last year is another good example of you just found a way and you end up in the playoffs. So obviously Mike's the voice of the team, but how much now do you guys like he relies on you because the coach can't say everything right, so you have to be the voice for kind of him or the defensive coordinator. Uh, you feel that weight as a leaders is something now that's just part of the gig, you know, I think my team gives us the landscape in the environment to do it. UM. And then I think it goes to the players. UM. You know, we have to be competitive as hell. We have to hold each other accountable. UM. We have to push each other. UM. You know, I I really do, UM enjoy practicing in Troy training UM with guys because then you you get a level of trust. You understand what players can do what they can't. UM. But the communication gets better. And I've always been a big proponent on UM. Your leaders got to lead, and UM, I gotta make sure I do my job. T J Naji um Manka. These guys are you know, the stalwarts that got to lead the front and got to lead the group. So we appreciate that. But we we we always want to, you know, make sure that we're pushing each other and making sure we're getting after each other. Obviously in college, you know, you guys despise your rival. I mean it's one of the best rivalries in America and probably in the world. Will how to stay first Michigan in the pros, I think sometimes, you know, it feels just because guys move teams, it's it's not quite the same. But You guys have had a rival for you know, a couple of decades, even before you got there, because you've been on the team the whole time, doesn't feel is genuine? Is the rivalry that you had in college with Michigan? And would you describe your feeling store of the Ravens as hatred? What? Oh? Man? Um the Ravens. It's it's weird. It's it's the level of respect, um, Because is that different than Michigan? Like, do do you respect Michigan? No? I don't respect anybody from Michigan. Uh uh, you see, It's it's different, right, It's very different, Like, Ohio, stay in Michigan. There is a hatred there, like and um, you can go back to the Bosham Beckler days, Hayes days. Um, you know that's the team up north and when you lose to them, god forbid. I never lost to them, So I don't know that feeling. Um. But but you have to you're representing your your school and those are bragging rights. Um. When you get to the league, it's not just about like representing like your team and bragging rights. Man. These dudes are professionals, um. And there's been a level of success from both teams, UM, and it is. I just remember those those night games Steelers Ravens where you had Troy palm All and ray Lewis on both sides, like like that is iconic. You had drum Bettis going up against ray Lewis, you had Troy palm Allo uh sacking Um Joe Flacco UM or him picking up um uh what was an interception and then returning it and watching the whole stands shake like that was exciting to me, and I think that's what made the rivalry. Um Kind's ward um making sure he had some of those those clear kill blocks I call him. You know, those those games changed football, like Ryan Clark laying out Willis mcgahey. They literally put in the rules in the NFL because these guys were killing each other. And you you watch it and you're like, okay, you understand the rivalry because this game escalated quickly and they were both teams were on the cusp of you know, trying to win Super Bowls. UH, and you know that's what we always have to live up to. Um. There's no reason to try to get up for Baltimore because you're already up. UM. And I've appreciated that time, and um, I always look forward to playing Baltimore Ravens because it's a it's a physical game and you better bring your big board pants because uh, you'll get exposed if you don't. With some of those Marvin Lewis teams, you guys in Cincinnati had a couple of year run where it was teetering on like this ship is crazy, what is going on? Yeah? Like you know, if you listen to the TV copy of UM the playoff game, UM, you can hear a level of discuss and the announcers and you're like, oh my gosh, like this is like the way they talk about You're like, you would think we were in a full out war. Yeah, and you know Jujus block on Mantes perfect And like before that game, Vantes was getting into it with one of our old alignment to Castro. And if you get the Castro talking, you know something's wrong because the Castro is like a psychopath. He doesn't talk and he's just focused on football. But this game you hear the Castro start chirping. So then I remember that game, the Castro was pulling and Vantes was coming around it. The cast was just laid them out and you're just thinking like these this type of game is like, it's a petty personal game. There's no there's not a respect there. There there was no respect there, uh in the personal fouls that came from that. And I think it all started from when Vantes hit Lebian out of bounds because he ended Lebian's year and we were like, okay, like you took it at a step farther where it was outside the game. It wasn't just you know, going at each other in the in the confines of the game. You went out of your way to hurt a player who we love, beloved and you know, stood up for. So now you just you're poking the bear. So now you're gonna get it all. And um, you know pac Man was there, uh, you know, chirping with Joey. Uh. And then with the refs, that game had to be one of the um insane games for us to win and be a part of. Like we went out on a series that was we were supposed to. Uh, they were gonna they ran out the clock, they were gonna win the game. Ryan ends up Ryan says, he ends up stripping the ball and then we recover it and you see Ben Roethlisberger come out of the tunnel because he was hurt and takes us down the field. UM, and I think they knocked a b out. Oh that was another hit. Um, they knocked a b out of the game. UM. And then Chris Boswell kicks in between the uprights. We win that game, and everybody is We're not shocked, but everybody around is shocked that we came out of this game as a winner. UM. But it was it was crazy there for a second. It's crazy. You've been on some teams. I thought the year that Chayzer got got injured, you guys were the best team in the league. And so you've played on teams that you know, Salmon Salm in college. I mean, you've been right there. To be a champion, to be a Super Bowl champion. Is that something that just kind of you know, you're you're a pretty high level motivated guy anyway, but is that kind of an easy thing to just think about, Like I haven't got over the mountaintop yet, It honestly is, UM, because I've been so close. UM. And it's one or two players that change it sometimes. But I feel like there's gonna come a time where I get over this damn hump, like you know, uh, and I would even take it back to high school. We went to the state championship and UM, you know there was there was the year before we went to the state championship, they had made a rule that you could tie in the state championship because the year before a kicker had missed and um, you know, had went through a lot of harassment. UM. And then in college, I mean in high school, we UM went to state championship and tied, and that was the worst, one of the worst feelings because it's like, how do I celebrate a tie in the state championship? We still our rings, but like, man, that like did not sit well with me. And then college, you know, freshman year starting national championship and we tricked it off and did not win. UM and then uh all throughout there, I wish we had college playoffs back then because that would have been fun to be a part of. UM. We ended up going to the Sugar Bowl my senior year we won versus Arkansas, but I never got to play in national championship again. UM. And now I'm just I've been the playoffs, UM, and all I want is a Super Bowl. All I want is a championship. Uh that that is the crowning moment. I'm looking forward towards you. You said the word. So I remember last year sitting on my couch. You're playing the Lions, right, you know, a trenial downpour and the game finishes the tie? Correct? What's it? What's it? What's it feel like? I know we hear the coaches talk neither one's happy. What was it like as a player when over time hits a double zero in both teams at the same score and you finished with a tie. I'mnna be honest. I was hot, like I was piste off like um, and that's not a shot at like what the Lions did because Lions UM did some things well in that game. But damn we I don't I don't ever want to end on us high. UM. I don't feel comfortable with it. UM. I don't feel comfortable with losses. I look at as a loss. Um. But somehow that got us into the playoffs. So you know, I couldn't be that upset about it. Well, I know you've been in the mix for the Man of the Year, You've been the representative for the Steelers. I was reading about your foundation. I mean I didn't know this, but you can sell on cam Heyward Foundation dot dot org dot org. Um that you had severe asthma as a child, and uh, you know I had bounced with asthma, but nothing like you were hospitalized. And is that something how did you get over it? And is that something you still deal with to this day? Oh? I still deal with that. Um. You know I take my tailor before every game. Um. You know, when my chest does get very tight, I have to get on a nebulizer or machine that helps with my breathing. Um. But growing up, I was a complete mess. Um. You know, thank God for my parents because I put them through uh some hard times. Um. You know growing up, my mom never was always scared about me playing sports and you know, over exerting myself because uh there was an opportunity that I could suffer from it. Um. But through sports, I was able to strengthen my lungs um, and you know continue to keep growing in it. Um. I like I'm from Pittsburgh, but now I'm back in Pittsburgh. Um. You know I remember those times going to the hospital and Christmas nights um, because I had an allergic reaction from uh, a real Christmas tree, and um, my asthma flared up and now I couldn't even breathe. Um. And I couldn't imagine putting or watching my kids go through that. Uh, that would be heartbreaking. Um. But luckily I'm here today and you know, um My foundation helps with asthma and helps with children in need. So you know, I want to make sure I do my part. I lost my dad about four years ago from cancer, but I was you know what basically your age. Now. I know your dad, Ironhead Heyward, who was a famous football player. You lost him. Was it your senior year in high school? Yeah, before my senior And it's something you know, I've followed your career from afar. You know, I say this all the time about the NFL. The majority of guys are such high level and that's why when guys get in trouble, it's such a minority of the overall group, you know, especially relative to society. But you, I would say, or even on the higher end of that. And you know being in the mix too. When your feels like inevitability to win the award one day, is that a moment because they say, remember Scott Van Peltz's you never become kind of a grown up till you know, you lose your father. And it's something, you know, it's a jolting feeling. But it's one thing to be an adult, it's it's another thing. I can't imagine. Was that something that matured you to have you always just would you can set yourself a mature guy? Is it? Was that just a moment that you know, it's a life changing moment obviously, but it's a life changing moment. And um, you know, James our our producer, can attest I am not mature. What's whatsoever? Uh? You know? I uh, you know, I am a big kid at heart. UM. I love to have fun. Um and UM I like to think I'm matured later on in life. Um. You know obviously had to be there for my brothers and my mom, but they were there for me. Um, and I had to grow up. Um. You know my mom was U such a big stand out in my life, especially when my dad died. Um she would she was like my She handled all my recruiting. Uh so I when we went to Ohio State. You know, I wish my dad was there to help, you know, guide me through this process. But she was in the forefront, you know, asking teams, Um, what do you play at three or four or four three? What do you see him more as a D tackle d n UM? What weight do you want him at? Um? You know, all these different questions, and I'm like, I'm so glad she's asking these questions and not me, because I wouldn't have had a clue what to ask um as a as a seventeen year old, You're like thinking, like, oh, this is why I will say, yeah, this is great. But my mom was preparing me um for you know, uh, the next level and making sure I was gonna be in a in a great spot. Do you think there's any way in two the you don't end up at Georgia, how do they let you get out of the state the way they're going to Kirby. Kirby might have just jumped on your back and refused to let you go. Yeah. I don't think Georgia was happy I was leaving the first place, because like, um, who was there? Mark Rick was there, and you know they've some great coach they were um. But man, I like, my second choice would have been Florida, and that would have really upset all the Georgia people. Um Urban was there and um, you know, I was very close to going to Florida, but I went to the Ohio State game. It was an unofficial game for me, and you know, I was a little bit sick, and my mama and me, we're like, you know, we can't make an official because it was too late. So we drove up ourselves and it was the one verse two game, Ohio State versus Michigan. Uh, and the winner was going to the National Championship? Was that what Troy Smith was quarterback? Yes, And I was like, like we got out there and you start seeing like ESPN is like like ABC is like like showing this game. So you're seeing the camera fly across. You're seeing like the Ohiose State band come out at halftime, and you're like, oh, this is a different like type of game. This is like everybody's watching. I want to be a part of this, and like we just from then on it was like everything was said off like coach Stress is awesome. He cares about you as a person. Um, they care about your academics. Um. The players, they're like James Laura Nitis was like my one of my hosts and getting to interact with him. I was like, this dude is awesome. This guy has won the buckets and now I get to talk to him. He's just like a regular guy. Um. That was one of my favorite trips and I was just I was like, I gotta come here. This is Ohio State, Like I want to be a Buckeye, you know speaking. Uh, you obviously got a podcast starting not uh not Just Football Podcast with Camp Heyward, which I was just thinking about to ask this question. You know, you're doing a podcast for Omaha paid An Eli, two guys you tried to kill for years before they both retired. Tell me about your podcast and just how it all came to be, you know, working with Peyton and Eli. Yeah. So the podcast is called Not Just Football with Camp Heyward. Um we uh we were flipping around through names for forever and you know, for me, I didn't want to just be tied down to just football. I wanted to be able to talk other sports because I love basketball, I love all different types of sports. I love pop culture too, so um, you know it was It's funny how this all worked out. Uh. You know, Peyton and his people reaching out the people at Omaha. Um. You know, I Peyton actually played with my dad and I can't wait to have him on my show one of these times because I want to ask them so many different stories. Um, because I remember we were in Indianapolis, and you know, I think Pelon was struggling, but like my mom and dad were telling me like he's gonna be the truth one day, and they were right. But you know, now, this dude's my boss. So this is a little weird. A guy I got the chance to play against is now my boss. And um, you know they create great shows and great content. Um, but this is unfiltered uh you know uh um perspective of what a day in life, of what I go through. Um, how or prepare what I'm looking at, how I see you know, sports, and how I see pop culture. So I'm I'm ready. Um, I got my one of my friends to come on. He's gonna be my co host. He's gonna be busting my balls a little bit too, so it's gonna be a good time. You know. Obviously Draymond his podcast shot like a rocket ship, but basketball is a little different scheme. You know, Steph Curry shooting the ball and he's talking a lot of ship in football. You know, it's like with the culture talking about other guys you're playing. You know, it's a little frowned upon by my coaching staff. Is the balance that that probably wouldn't be it's not necessarily your style. But I don't think anyone can pull that off in the NFL, right, You're right, Like I've seen like basketball players going like talk shows and literally like talk crap about a player. Like I'm not with all that, Like that's not what I'm going to do. Like I'm here to you know, broaden my horizons and learn and have fun with people and you know, grow great awareness to our game that we love, um, and provide a lot of insight because um, a lot of times you get these players after they're done. Like you know, I I can recall when Jerome used to do his show after he was done with football, and you know, I just think this is a really cool platform to you know, talk to a current player. Um. And you know, I'm not I might have to have a couple of those were you know, we win or we lose. I'm going straight to the pod. Make sure you can stay tuned, But I'm not using this time to call it nobody. Um, if anything, I'm using this time to call it myself, uh and hold myself accountable. The difference in football than the NBA is like physically you could get you know, crackback block. I mean you could get you know, at the NBA. You don't touch anybody, you know what I get you out here on this I remember when I was scouting, a famous story was, you know, Steelers have always been held to the highest regard from a scouting perspective, and Jack Lambert they were like a practice at Kent State when he was in college and one of the Steeler scouts was there and they were it was like an outside walk through, you know, in the sixties or whatever, on gravel and Jack was going hundred miles an hour tackling people bloodied on the gravel. And the Steeler scout like went back to the Mooney's were like, he's our guy, and then they get that's just you know, these legends of Steelers scout and it's just but it's lived that right too. When I was a kid, Greg Lloyd's to Harrison and Lamar Woodley's to just to now you and t J and Minca. I mean, you do get to play for a team that one the fan base is massive to football means everything. And three you just thought of, like, if you start on defense with the Steelers, you are a badass. It's got cool. Well, like I remember hearing about how like the scout bill none with like hold on to certain tapes because back then they were supposed to like share the film with everybody, but like they didn't, and so build None, you know, he held onto the tape and nobody knew about certain players. So you know, the scouting department has always been ahead of everybody else and has always um found great players. Um. But when you put on that black and gold man, you are really embracing a tough defense demeanor. Um, it's um something I'm proud of, something I gotta live up to every day, and I just enjoy it. Um, I think everything, Thank God every day that I'm able to be a Pittsburgh Steeler. Well, I'm looking forward to watching you guys play on defense because every year you guys just cracking people left and right and watching Nagy play and you know the quarterback situation is gonna be fun. So you know, you guys make the playoffs basically every year so I expect you back there. I look forward to some boy. Yeah, it's good luck to you man. Stay healthy and good luck with the new media. Baby, new media. I got some part of new media. No skipping weeks, CAM, no skipping weeks, no skipping weeks, Yes, James will let us, we got it. Take it easy, bro, Thanks a lot, appreciate you, John, Thank you for having me on. No problem the volume wou